All,

I am currently wrapping a rod based on a 13' 10/11 wt spey blank. I will be using it as a UK style float/match rod. I have installed a vetre matrix handle (10" rear carbon grip) with a cork fighting butt and rubber end cap. The guides are Hopkins & Holloway Seymo RDX match guides from www.guidesnblanks.com. My question is as follows: What would most of you finish theis rod with, urethane (permagloss) or epoxy (flex-coat). The rod is already s bit tip heavy (13'-5") so I will be adding a bit of weigh in the butt tube after it is all done, so I don't want to add more weigh to the tip. Thanks.

The amount of weight difference you're talking about would be extremely slight. It's not going to make much difference, but if you want the lightest possible finish, use 2-3 coats of Permagloss or apply the epoxy very thinly.

.......................

Thanks, Tom.

That's what I was considering. The rod is wrapped with "A" thread with no underwrap and no overlapping threads at the guide wraps so I don't need anything thicker once the threads are all sealed and smooth.

No mater what finish you use it is hard to lighten up a 13' rod

Bill - willierods.com

John..

I have to ask why did you use these guides? And did you use double footed or single? Just curious, thanks.

Paul

personally I like threadmaster lite. 10/11 wt spey is a beast of a float rod. Is he carp float fishing with it?

I will be using it primarily for panfish, but there are carp to 30lbs, bass, and channel cats in the water I am fishing, so I wanted something with a light enough tip to cast a waggler with 1/4 oz but also have enough backbone if something sizeable were to hit. I guess that's why they call it custom.

I used the guides because all my other spinning rods have the traditional larger guides and I was curious to see how a small ring, high standoff guide would perform. The stripper guide ring is a 10, and yes they have two feet, but the feet are short and the frame is flexible. After I received the guides, Mudhole added Pac Bay match guides to their stock. The RDX guides come in single foot and double foot, but I ordered the set which came only in double foot for my first such build.

Also, so far the rod is lighter than an 8'-6" Graphite Daiwa Steelhead rod (store bought) that I have although it is a bit tip heavy. I want the rod to be butt heavy so after all the guides and finishing is complete, I will be tuning the weight balance by adding weight inside the tube of the handle.

Thanks for the responses.

Well good luck. That is an extremely powerful rod for the intended use but if it fits what you are looking for then go with it....

I know it sounds like the rod is super stiff, but when I static tested it it flexes into the butt wrap. I guess the proof will be in the fish fighting.

What reel are you putting on it?

For the most part, I only build float rods. Personally if you want a lighter rod that feels more like the naked blank, I would not use traditional float road guides aka high frames. Why some float rod builders and manufaturers are still using these guides is beyond me. The guide is substantially heavier than low profile, single foot, fly rod guides.

The difference is amazing...

Just my .02

Paul is dead on here. I have been using flexlites (not a fly guide but close in wieght) on all my float rods, you cannot get much lighter and they work just great. I run moster drifts and have not seen a difference with flexlites and ceramic ring guides when it comes to friction. The difference is in the action! much faster and true with the flexlites due to wieght.

That being said for steelhead I do not even use a rod as heavy as you are for much lighter fishing.

A 2500 size reel.

Too late to change guides now, the wrapping is done. Anyway, not to dispute the facts, but how much weight reduction are we talking about and if it is a few grams, how noticeable is it? I am fairly accustomed to handling heavier rods for a fair period of time and though you are probably right on the facts, I don't if I am convinced that it would make much of anoticeable difference.

Also the rod is not being modeled after a steelhead float rod, but a UK style match rod where the rod needs flexibility to cast light weight but has enough beef for the occasional carp.

By the way, are permagloss and spar urethane interchangeable and if not what is the difference.

Thanks

john backos Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> Also the rod is not being modeled after a
> steelhead float rod, but a UK style match rod
> where the rod needs flexibility to cast light
> weight but has enough beef for the occasional
> carp.


Not sure how much "flexiblity" you are going to get out of a 10/11 spey rod. They blanks I use for my steelhead rods will toss 5gm floats all day witout issue. I have been known to drop to a 3.5 on low clear winter days. Just wanted make sure you knew what you were getting thats all. Let us know how it works.

You probably see a difference in a rod that heavy.
You would do well to add some lead in the butt or you could end up with some serious wrist and elbow issues with prolonged use.
I have a 15' 9/10 wt spey I'm building as a float rod for baby tarpon to 30 or 40 pounds. :)

I have put king salmon to 45# & carp to 55#'s on the bank with my old 16' custom Fenwick float rod loaded with 4# test back in the 80's
IMHO unless you are dealing with some very snaggy H2O the 10/11 wt could be a little heavy for fishing day in and day out, but you won't know until you fish it. :)

Regards
Dave

Fishing is Life the rest is just Details

JOHN:

The difference is night and day, and black and white! I have built many float rods, and the guides you used are about 2/3 heavier. That, compounded with twice the thread and twice the thread finish equates to night and day.

I have several 10/11 spey blanks I use for Chinook Salmon, all of which have single foot FLexlite guides or low profile fly guides.

Don't subject yourself to more wight in the rod than what is necessary. And, adding more weight tot he butt of the rod cause the fronts too heavy is going backwards in methodology and practicality with todays components.

Hope this helps.
Paul

Dave Orr Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You probably see a difference in a rod that
> heavy.
> You would do well to add some lead in the butt or
> you could end up with some serious wrist and elbow
> issues with prolonged use.
> I have a 15' 9/10 wt spey I'm building as a float
> rod for baby tarpon to 30 or 40 pounds. :)
>
> I have put king salmon to 45# & carp to 55#'s on
> the bank with my old 16' custom Fenwick float rod
> loaded with 4# test back in the 80's
> IMHO unless you are dealing with some very snaggy
> H2O the 10/11 wt could be a little heavy for
> fishing day in and day out, but you won't know
> until you fish it. :)

From June to September, my local waters get weed choked to the degree that you need to drop the float into small pockets and along weed edges to have any chance of catching anything. Some of the pockets are as small as 5' dia and as far away as 40 yards. While my 8'-6" steelhead rod was adequate in reaching the pockets and playing fish in the open, I found the amount of line that needed to be mended on the strike was too much for the rod length causing too many missed strikes. Conversely, my 6' spinner with 6lb mono was OK for fighting fish, but casting a float rig and mending line on the hookset were a nightmare.

Also, the weeds became an issue when I had hooked into a channel cat of unknown size which after a 15 min fight, became tangled in weeds and broke off 4lb spidewire near the bank. So, I wanted the combination of the added rod length for line mending, plus the insurance of blank flexibility and length for handling fish in close that led me to this style of rod.

I could have easily bought a match rod from the UK for 1/3 the cost to build, but then what's the fun in that? So, when the rod is fished, we will see how the experiment pans out. I may even try it out in the salt.

Thanks to all for the lively discussion.