I received this in the mail yesterday and thought it would be easier to generate the exchange the reader was hoping for by posting it here.

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8 July 2010


Dear Tom,

I read with extreme interest your comments on “State of the Industry” in the letters section of Volume 13, Issue 3. (Dealing with the tremendous oversaturation of manufacturers, dealers and product duplication in the rod building industry.)

Having just returned from the fourth time this year displaying my sample rods at a Craft/Sporting show, again without a sale or order, and having spoken to other rod builders about their sales, I believe, not only are the manufacturers and suppliers in jeopardy, but most rod builders themselves are certainly not prospering.

I believe I offer a quality product at a fair price, yet the average anglers are more interested in price than quality. Not that I can blame them, when there are adds in the big box stores for “rods” with reels for $19.99. Yes, most are Chinese junk, but as a rod builder, $19.99 doesn’t even cover my taxes, let alone the cost of shipping and components, making it impossible to compete on a price basis.

Touting quality, uniqueness, lifetime guarantees, and a “would you trust landing the fish of a lifetime to a low cost rod” gets some interest from the serious fishermen, who take your business card with a promise of “I’ll call you,” which lately never happens.

Yes, I would love to support the distributors and manufacturers, but having spent several hundred dollars on advertising, sporting shows and sample inventory without a sale for 2010, and expecting a slow turn around in this economy, from my perspective, it looks like the manufacturers, dealers AND the rod builders are hurting.

I would love to hear if other rod builders are in agreement with my comments.

Thanks for letting me vent!

Tom Baranowski
Chicago, IL

I agree about the oversaturation of companies and product in this industry. Do we really need a dozen different types of epoxy finishes, which in reality are all very similar? Do we need a dozen companies importing what for all intents and purposes are the same reel seats, guides and rod blanks? How much in the way of winding checks, hookkeepers, thread and other assorted bling can the rod builders who make up this craft absorb? Unless this craft is one heck of a lot bigger than I think it is, a lot of what’s going on lately with product introductions/duplications just doesn’t make any sense to me.

On the other hand I totally disagree with the state of custom rod sales. I guess it depends on your market. I have never tried to market my custom rods to the guys who buy the $19.99 outfits. Heck, I don’t even bother with the guys who buy $75 rods. I try to aim for the dedicated fisherman that is already spending $150 or more on the better quality factory rods. They already understand quality and performance and are obviously willing to pay for it so I figure those are the guys I need to spend my time cultivating. 2010 has not been bad at all for me. I don’t do this for a living but I’ve sold quite a few rods this year and made a decent profit on each one.

Maybe you need to reconsider your market and fine tune it to reach the fishermen who are already spending money on upper end equipment. Forget the big box store shoppers. I think there is also a "hook" to offering the fisherman something he cannot get in a factory made rod. Just copying factory made rods is not something I would waste my time doing. Just my .02!

I think that most custom rod builders treat Rod building as supplemental income. Depending on your area you may or may not sell many rods. I build custom rods because i love doing it and when i can do a custom rod for a client it's just frosting on the cake. I don't particularly agree with you on manufactures and supply houses.Suppliers have adjusted to the economy and do not carry as much inventory and the drop shipments have increase because of this.
Just my opinion

Paul

Paul@soonercustomrod.com

I'm not sure just when the first question out of the average consumer's mouth became, "How much?". It used to be that we cared about quality and making a wise decision. I'm sure it had something to do with products becoming "throw away" devices. Things like computers and many consumer electronics become obsolete so quickly. It wasn't long ago that we expected a washing machine, TV, or refrigerator to last a few decades.

I have some rods and reels that are very old, perhaps older than I am. Todays rods are vastly superior but the reels are still fine to fish with. I wonder if someone bought a top notch rod today if it would or wouldn't be a competitive fishing tool sixty years into the future. I also wonder if salt water anglers are more or less inclined to spend a bit extra for quality.

Sadly I don't think our economy will ever be what it once was. I'm hoping the oversaturation lasts just long enough for me to replace my old gear. Selfish no doubt but there is little left in the budget for hobbies.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

If you have not had a sale in 2010 then either A) your product is not as good as you think or B) you have the wrong product for your area, or C) more than likely your future customers don't know you exist. You have to hit the market target with your ads. I have helped out in a nearby town with some tournament and league prizes and have not had one single phone call or sale from that effort, so all "advertising" is not effective.

I think you need to target the people that are buying quality gear now. When they see that you can give them a better product, built just as they really want it and in their favorite colors to boot you will have something.

I am busier than I want to be and I don't advertise at all. Perhaps you need to get the rods in the customers hands. I like to take people out in my boat and hand them a rod and say "chunk that out there and see what you think".

Chuck

I have to add that I sold three 8' crankbait rods to three guys just by taking a guy out and letting him use mine. Word spreads!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2010 03:21PM by Chuck Mills.

Two things __

Every time a fisherman - or woman learns how to make there own rod --- why do they need us

Also look at rods - on the shelf stuff -- using ever thing we use. __ for a lot cheaper

I get more calls of - what do you want to build me -- HOW LOW CAN I GO - Then it is like charge double labor rate for a Plain Jain and the heck with it.

Why were car dealers and companies using computers making it harder for the Home Mechanic to tune up his own car
They were loosing money - They wanted the car owner to go to the dealer -- which charges a heck of a lot - to do the work

Bill - willierods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/15/2010 03:35PM by bill boettcher.

As reference, I build bass and inshore rods. My sales are up 20% this year and I am about to increase close to another 20% through some joint efforts currently in development. My "plain" builds (similar to a production rod) are priced over $200 with a budgeted 3 hours hands on time to build a rod (this doesn't include dry times, etc). My top end rods go for more with pricing dependent on variables.

My sales increases are not only among the bass market, but also inshore salt - with the strongest growth area being the gulf coast (yes even with the oil spill).

It's easy to blame the economy and market saturation. Here's a question - you said - "they take a card and don't call back" - why aren't you getting their info and calling them? If you know handing out cards isn't working why continue and hope?

If you are going to treat rodbuilding as a true business, you need to work accordingly. Building the rods is only one part. You need the business end as well. Identify a target market, how to address that market, create a brand and brand image, budget, find efficiencies, etc.

Example 1: I have a very defined target market for inshore rods. There are loads of guys fishing for trout and reds recreationally. I only target the tournament redfish guys. Keep in mind I am selling to guys 500+ miles away so putting a rod in hand isn't an option. I had to develop ways to sell to these guys while still generating profit and growing my brand.

Example 2: I don't pay for a lot of my local advertising. I've worked to develop a brand associated with quality products. I have clients and noncustomers who buy tshirts to wear and logo decals for their vehicles and boats. They pay for these items. I've built brand awareness so that the logo itself creates familiarity. When I talk to a prospective client they have already heard about the rods or seen a logo. Ice already broken and makes the job of selling a rod a little easier.

Lots more to it. Be glad to share info if anyone wants more. Drop me an email. For the record - I've never had a customer try to talk me off price.

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AD

I personnally think the economic conditions are worse in most areas than people think. I have been to several states lately where unemployment used to be reasonably low and is now high and getting worse. When your
average fisherman can't afford to go out fishing because he/she has to save every penny to feed the family or keep their house, dont expect them to buy a custom rod at any price. There are still a lot of folks out there that have their jobs and can still buy custom rods, but not nearly as many as before. One thing I think that is disguising the situation is that I have talked to several people where both they and their spouse were once employed. Now, one of them has been layed off and they are having to scrape by on only one persons salary. They are not in great danger of losing their house, cars, or way of life but they are hurting financially. My suspicions is that the average unemployment rate is really more like 15% across the boards. That takes a lot of money out of circulation and as one of the guys said, there goes the recreation funds. Tom B. is in Chicago and I would expect that the number of potential customers there has been cut in half or more due to the economy. Virtually every fishing guide and business on the Great Lakes is hurting for business. This is repeated all over the country. A motel owner friend in an upscale, normally high volume resort area told me recently that business has been off 65% for the last 6 months. There must be lots and lots of these types of examples. We just have to work together to fix the economy or the people who control the economy. Just my perspective.

Dave

Bill, I'll answer that question. It is the same answer that I give to every professional craftsman whose services I utilize. Many of them know me well enough to know that I am fully capable of doing the job that I hire them for. I run a maintenance shop at a hospital so I hire more than the average Joe.

The answer is, "Because this is your full time profession and I must wear many hats. You have the advantage of knowing the latest and greatest items in your field. Over the years you have always delivered top quality work and I can trust you to listen to my needs and offer sage advice and provide the best solution for my unique needs and conditions. Besides, I have too many other things on my plate and need the help".

I am a very tough sell but a very loyal customer. I would welcome the chance to meet someone in my area whom I could steer others to who see what I build and express an interest in a custom rod. I would build something for a family member. A friend would have to beg hard and convince me. I have no interest nor intention of ever selling a rod.

The only reason I build is to be able to afford to fish. My preference is for blue water fishing and even a "decent" off the shelf rod is beyond my means. I have grown up making my money with my tools. I learned long ago that it is better to buy one snap-on wrench a week than a whole set of no-name knukle busting wrenches.


So, don't see me as someone taking away business. See me as someone showing the public the worth of a custom rod and wanting to hook them up with a builder whom I trust to provide them a superior product at a fair price.

Please don't think my tone testy as I took no offense. I'm just a crusty old salt and come off the wrong way too often:)

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

I'm like a lot of others in that I do this as a part time, side job. There is no way that I could make enough money building rods to replace my regular salary. Maybe in a few years, when I retire, it will be a nice supplement to whatever is left of Social Security and my 401K.

My sales therefore are not that high, but as high as I want them to be. When I first started, I did a little bit of promotion, and quickly got to the point that I had more than I could handle. So, these days, I just use word of mouth advertising, and mostly sell to bass fisherman. The last half of 2009 was a little bit slower than normal, and this year started slowly. But, about April sales really took off, and I'm ahead of my normal pace year to date.

I think that there are a good number of fisherman that are going to fish if there is any way possible, and the fact that they are not making as much money as they once did is not going to make them stop. I've sold two rods recently to guys that have lost their jobs. But, they still have their bass boats, and keep on fishing!

First of all I do not build rods to make a living or even a profitable income. I do sell quite a few rods but most of the rods I build are to be given away to soldiers.
I would not go into the business of providing components or supplies to rodbuilders unless I had a really unique product or a product that was far better than anything else on the market. There are some new products that fit that catagory and I appreciate that they are available.
As far as custom rods vs off the rack rods, there is no way to compete. We cannot buy the components to build a rod as cheap as the exact same components on a factory rod already built. There many, many manufacturers that are bulding some terrific quality rods. We as rodbuilders come up with terrific ideas and as soon as those ideas are proven to be more than just a gimmick the manufacturers start producing them. We were the first with split grips, no foregrip, spiral wrap, and micro guides as well as many more inovations that are now used by mass manufacturers. Personally I am proud that we are the inovators and they are the followers although I have never come up with a worthwhile inovation.
Pat

The bottom line is that 98% of the fishing public is just downright cheap. Given the choice of paying a modest price for first-rate craftsmanship or yanking a fish out of the water with a broomstick, the vast majority of fishermen would choose the latter. Maybe for most folks, fishing is nothing more than drinking beer while holding onto cheap graphite sticks-the "sticks" serve only to convince their spouses that the beer is not the primary passion. (Not that there's anything wrong with that). For several years, I have helped a friend with his booth at the Expo. His work is phenomenal and he had a large amount of it reduced to ridiculous prices-I'm talking 25 bucks for hand-turned, ready to install, wood grips, split grip sets and all types of composite split grips-stuff they, by their comments, had no ability to desire to make themselves. I saw the same people come back repeatedly, pick up and admire the work, agonize over any purchase as if they were deciding whether to by a Maserati or a Jaguar. These folks never could pull the trigger. I ended up buying a bunch of the stuff -that's how ridiculously low the prices were-and I can make the stuff myself. I know we are not in the best economic times, but this has been a consistent as long as I've been coming to the expo, so that cannot explain it.
It boggles my mind how many golfers who can't hit a ball out of their shadow, think nothing about buying a $600.00 driver or a $1500.00 set of irons so they can hit the ball just past their shadow. For some reason those same people wouldn't pay $200.00 for a custom rod. That has always been puzzling to me, but it's true-the market for custom fishing rods is quite small. Tapping into that market to make a living building rods is extremely hard.

I build rods as a side line only: That gives me the luxury to be very picky what i do and for whom.
I turn away repairs and builds daily. But perhaps its because i live in an area (Memphis TN) where there are very few other builders around. I go fishing with the owners and managers of the local and big box tackle stores and they have bought my rods after seeing and using them. So it may be who i know. Or maybe they like what i do ?

I like having the choices the current supplier mix affords me. The competitiveness drives innovation.

Exactly David

I had a guy wanting a bass rod - to pitch under docks - he whent to some one else because of a 30.00 lower price. We could have talked about that.

When he got the rod back , when he used it the handle was to long and hit his gut.

Mine would have been the right size. Told him that, but people have short memories.

Bill - willierods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/16/2010 09:16AM by bill boettcher.

Yes, 99 % of the fishing public is downright cheap. The good news is that the remaining 1% still represents a LARGE number of people who fish. It is true that the vast number of people (in my area, at least) spend less than $50 for a rod and reel combination to use for all their fishing needs. That tackle is going to be used to fish from shore for catfish and flounder, sunfish and bass, and they will attempt to use it on a party boat (head boat) to catch bluefish, snapper and grouper over the reefs.

My question is this: "So what?" These people are not my target demographic anyway.

I pay little attention to the economy. I used to build rods in Vermont, where the economy has NEVER been good. And I sold a LOT of rods at a good price. Many were to people who wanted to own ONE GOOD ROD. Sometimes they talked with me on and off for a year or more before buying...and I later found out that during that year they were saving their money to buy the rod. Others saw a good rod as the one nice thing they might buy for themselves or a family member. Point is, they had the desire and determined they NEEDED the rod (or they wanted it more than they want anything else).

Were I to be displaying my rods at a show, it would be for the purposes of MARKETING and not for selling. Marketing is creating the desire, making the public aware of what you offer and why they can't live without it. Marketing is NOT selling the actual product. It is making someone aware of the product and leading them to conclude that they would like to have the product. Selling is actually convincing them to give you some of their money in exchange for the product. Stated another way, marketing creates the need, (creates an itch), and selling satisfies the need (scratches the itch). Marketing is convincing someone to FEEL that they need something. Selling is convincing them to ACT on the feeling.

Unlike Alex, most of my rods these days are for saltwater use, from flats rods and surf rods to 80 lb IGFA trolling rods and saltwater fly rods. When I moved to Florida 5 years ago I didn't know anyone, and NOBODY was even aware I built rods. And the economy had just peaked at its high point. From there on in, jobs were lost, housing prices went into free fall, boats were being sold at fire sale prices, and the repo business was (and is) a growth industry. Pawn shops flourished and construction companies, restaurants and even grocery stores closed.

So...you are surrounded by water, your hours have been cut, you can't afford to take the family to Disney or Universal or Sea World at $1000/day, and watching the Daytona 500 at the track requires a bank loan. So what makes you feel good? How about a day of fishing? Or LOTS of time fishing? (This was my premise in setting up shop during an economy that was tanking.)

Initially I spent very little time selling, but a LOT of time marketing. I wanted EVERYONE WHO MIGHT USE MY PRODUCTS AND SERVICES to know I existed. I put rods into the hands of fishing guides and asked them to use them for a week or two and give me their honest appraisal of the rod. I also gave them business cads for their clients, because I knew they would be recommending the rods. I told them I would give them 24 hour (or faster) turn around on most repairs.
I went to tackle shops and spoke with the owners, offering repair services as well as my services as a custom builder. (I now build for two of the largest shops in the area)

I did NOT waste my time marketing to the hoards of folks who line the shores, fishing with their $19.95 Shanghai specials. They are NOT my target audience. There might be one or two people among the hundreds that would buy a rod, but the time expended in finding them is not worth the return. My target demographic is the fisherman with a boat who fishes whenever he (or she) has the opportunity...the professional...the tournament fisherman...the person who enjoys owning quality equipment.

My business card says "Not for Everyone. Built JUST FOR YOU. And truly, custom rods are NOT for everyone, so don't waste your time trying to sell to everyone. I sell to guides, and to clients of guides who spend $500 for a day of "catch and release" fishing. I sell to folks who fish the tourneys. I sell to folks who can afford to buy.

My Facebook friends list is almost all fishing guides and fishermen (and other custom builders). Everyone who can help me sell rods knows I build quality rods. (Networking) And like Alex (who happens to be on my Facebook friend list, as are some other members of this forum), I am seeing a steady INCREASE in business, even in this economy. But if you want to operate a successful business, you need to treat it like a business. And like all other things, there is a learning curve. It requires consistent activity on your part to succeed...but it CAN be done.

I did a few shows early on in my rod building but soon found that they were a waste of time. Out of every 100 people that stopped by I would get maybe 2 calls. most people are just browsing and looking for bargains.
Because the economy is in the dumps and people are not buying new they are holding on to their old stuff longer. Instead of marketing new builds I turned to repairs. Fly fishing is very big in my area and that is my main focus
sure I have to carry a little more inventory but since my turnaround time is short the cash flow covers it.
I have an agreement with the local fly shops that I don't sell custom rods in their stores since they carry several high end brands but I get all their repair work.
Like others I let some of the local guides use my rods and i even have a few "demo" rods I will let potential customers borrow for a short trial run.
building a few rods was way cheaper than what I would pay for a show table. I no longer donate rods to all the popular @#$%& like T.U,. I did it a few times and found out most people bid on the factory rods and would pass over the custom build. Again it wasn't worth my time. I now give a gift cert. for dollars or a percentage off a new build or repair. They are always snatched up and bottom line cost is small.
I also specialize in doing bamboo restorations. granted it's a special market and has a huge learning curve, but it's worth it. I see it as a filling an area that nobody else around me is covering. if i'm out on the river and someone is using a bamboo rod I will hand them a card because sooner or later they will need my service.
Am i sending my kids to college on this money? no way.
I think what most of us are getting at is tht you need to focus on your customer and then market to that group.