I recently had a problem with the flocking on a rod I built. I finished the grips on this rod two weeks ago and fished with the rod this weekend. While I was fishing I constantly had flocking and adhesive coming off on my hands. The adhesive felt like it soaked through the flock and was still tacky after two weeks. This is probably the fifth rod I have done with this kit, and the first time I have had any problems. So, where could the failure be? I didn't change anything about my process of flocking, I followed Tom's directions to the T. My only though is that I didnt stir the adhesive enough, could this be the issue?

Also, what do you think my chances of scraping the flock off and redoing it will be? Anyone think this will work? I would hate to strip this all the way down, I did my first marble and I am really happy with it. But if I have to I guess I will.

Thanks,
Scott Sheets

If I can get some more information maybe I can help. What surface did you flock and how was it prepared prior application of the adhesive. Please use the Control Center at the top of the page and Confirm your email address or click on my name and send me an email so we can communicate off the board.

Bill Stevens

A lot of cork and preformed grips are treated. I would sand anything that I am flocking and coat it with U-40 Cork seal before applying the adhesice

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

Bill,
I confirmed my email, I never realized I had to do that before, thanks. The grips were cork handles that I assembled from rings w/ rodbond. I let the rodbond cure for 48 hours and then shaped the grips. Once I shaped them I sealed them with U40 Cork Seal which cured for a little over 24 hours. I then flocked the grips with the Donjer kit per the rodmaker directions.

Thanks,
Scott

Scott Mr. Barkley (formal ha MIke?) is I think exactly on the point. It sounds to me as if something was preventing the adhesive from bonding and it wouold seem to me to me a cork filler if it was a preformed grip. Most of the pre formed grips have a filler they use as the cork for them is a lower grade. After sanding and shaping they are "mudded" with the cork filler and then one last finish sanding and go. Some time take one you don't want and start sanding it. You will see great big gouges and seams under what appears to be a perfect grip.

The problem is the Cork Seal. It was discovered by Ralph O'quinn after the publication of the Article in Rodmaker that Trondak Cork Seal contained a very small amount of material that would hamper the proper cure of the alkyd adhesive. If you go back and read the Rodmaker you should find that the words, "seal the cork" were used and it also noted to use an acrylic color preserver to accomplish that end. These issues were dealt with quite completely in the Flocking Workshop Seminar sessions in High Point. The best materials,to use for prep on the cork is acrylic color preserver or a preliminary coat of the adhesive, prior to the coat that is used to secure the flock.

I have approval, from Tom Kirkman who sponsors the seminars at the International Custom Rodbuilding Exposition who holds the rights to this printed material, to send you a copy if you would like to see it. The article pictures the reasons for the failure mode you describe.

The only thing I can not help you with is the removal of the present material - what I have applied will not come off short of complete incineration! I would not try to flock over the top because the bond is non existant.

Bill Stevens



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 10/09/2007 03:24PM by Bill Stevens.

Bill,
Thank you for your offer, I would love to read that article. Thanks also for your help, it is much appreciated. If I have any success removing the existing mess I will post it, if not c'est la vie. Thanks to everyone for their help, I can't wait to try this again.

Scott, I am sorry this happened to you, but thank you for posting this and Bill, thanks the answer to Scott's problem.

Regards......Doug@
TCRds

The same basic thing happen to me, the problem was corrected thanks to the help here on the board. You can sand the flock off, I used drywall sandpaper and took my time, your grip may end up a hair smaller in diameter. Good luck.

Stan, are you talking about the drywal sanding screens or an actual paper product?

Thanks

Regular acrylic color preserver is the better product to use when sealing the cork. On pre-formed grips, you want to start by a light sanding of the cork in order to remove anything the grip maker has put on there.

.................

Yes the screens. Good luck.

Thanks everyone, I'll post my results.

While I have never actually flocked a grip, if you find that you can't remove the bad flocking without making your grips too small or ruining them all together, I have another idea you may be able to use.

Cut the old cork off and clean the rod. Glue up a new bunch of rings and turn to the shape you need. Ream the cork out to the inner diameter you need(this may take some work and measuring, plus you will probably need to go a bit more than you anticipated to make sure the ID is big enough). Put the cork on an old blank or wood dowel and using a straightedge, cut lengthwise through the cork all the way to the dowel with a sharp razorblade. Apply some rodbond to your grip area and carefully open the cut edge of the cork and slide it onto your rod. When you have it in position, coat the cut edges or the cork with a thin layer of the rod bond.

To hold everything in place and slightly "clamp" the grip together, I take some plastic wrap and cut 2 inch wide strips about 3 feet long and then wrap the grip under a small amount of pressure completely wrapping the grip.

Once the rodbond has cured, I pull off the plastic wrap, resand the grip, and there you go.

I have probably replaced about 15 old/nasty/damaged grips this way using cork and EVA and have never had and problems. Even without flocking, the seam where the edges meet are virtually invisible as long as the cork was reamed out large enough to surround the blank.

This is the process I use on Grade AAA commercial preformed cork grip sections.

If you take a look at the picture please click on the picture after it opens for an enlarged view. It will show you why in the dickens I flock grips in the first place. Many do not realize just how poor the quality of the preformed cork is we use. The cosmetic mudding done by the manufacturers hides the true picture of the cork in use. Instead of covering my grips with shrink wrap for delivery to a customer like the production guys I find it much more practical to really lock up the grip with a material that is superior to anything else on the market.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Please note the difference in the first two. If you were to use Trondak Cork Seal on this surface you will see that if the sealer contains any solvent that impedes the full cure of the alkyd that it will easily peel. I use extended cure times between each step. If you were to use denatured alcohol to wipe the second step the alkyd will not cure with the soaked filler underneath. The flocked grip when done correctly is a superior surface and will last indefnitely - I presently have rods in service that are four years old with no evidence of degredation - they are used an averabe of four time a month year round.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/10/2007 04:31PM by Bill Stevens.