All of the tutorials that I have seen on the static guide placement procedure for casting rods (and other "reel on top" rods) invariably has the process being done with the guides UP, which, of course, makes perfect sense. The exact opposite is true of the photos I have seen of fly rods being set up (including in Tom's book), in that the guides are facing downward. All of the times that I have used this procedure, I have noticed that it really does not make a lot of difference when I move a guide one way or the other. The line seems to follow the blank pretty well either way. And so, my thinking on this is, why bother? When in this position, the line will fairly naturally follow the curve of the rod no matter the care put into the spacing. Why not just us the guide spacing charts and be done with it?

On the other hand, it occurs to me that a fly rod ought to be static tested in the same position as a casting rod (guides up) since a LOT (at least 50% depending on your casting style) of the force put on the rod during casting is loading the rod with the guides forward (on top), and poor guide spacing in this position, especially given the diameter of a fly line, could have the distinct detrimental affect of the line slapping or sliding below the blank. This would be especially true when hauling during the casting stroke.

Do any of you have thoughts on this? Does anyone static test their fly rods with the guides up, and if so what is your experience?

Thanks,


Walt Natzke
Ripon, CA



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/01/2007 02:09PM by Walt Natzke.

With fly rods, I have always taken the St. Croix guide spacing chart as my starting point, loaded the rod to see the result, and almost never have I changed a single thing. And I have loved the results. I think the position and size of the butt and choke guide affects spinning rods but I have never noticed any difference on fly rods, with the one exception being that if there are too few guides and certain gaps that are too large, you tend to see the line slapping against the blank, which can't be good.

Walt,
You are on the right track. A fly rod is not any different than any other rod. Castability and fish fighting ability go hand in hand. What applies to a spinning rod or a casting rod also applies to a fly rod. If you do a static line test on a fly rod and the fly line is touching the blank you need to consider moving the guides or increasing the height of the guides. You should also be considering the size of the reel you'll be using. For the life of me I don't know why the majority of rod builders use the same size stripper guides on a 6 weight as a 15 weight but they do. Once you determine the guide spacing and size for a certain weight fly rod write those dimensions down because it has been my experience that they will work for any fly blank of the same weight with very little change or tweaking.
If we are doing a first time build on a new fly blank we always do a static test with the guides up and a reel that is commonly used on that weight fly rod to make sure we are using the right guide set up.

Michael A Taylor
Blue Water Fly Tackle

If you have enough guides, or even more than enough, it won't matter much if you move the guides around a bit. But if you have too few, or barely enough, it will make a great deal of difference when you move them around, even by a little.

The recent series of articles on fly rod guide, selection, sizing and spacing in RodMaker should make this easier to understand and to do.

...............

Actually, Tom, it was these articles that sparked the question in the first place.

Basically I originally thought that static guide placement for fly rods was always accomplished with the guides down, but I think now that guides up might be a better approach, providing more consistent results.

The relationship of the line to the blank will be essentially the same. If you do it guides, up, you'll likely end up with more guides than you actually need on a fly rod, particularly if you're trying to keep the line from touching the blank.

But you can certainly do it either way that suits you.

..................

Tom;
Would you name those recent back issues of RodMaker you mentioned above? I recently ordered some back issues but I don't know if those articles were included... Thought provoking discussion by the way...

Thank You, RON.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/02/2007 01:33AM by RON NIX.

The series started about midway through volume 9 and has been continuing since. The next issue will finish things up.

.............

Thank you all for your valuable input, both on and off the board.
My understanding of the process is much more complete!



Walt Natzke
Ripon, CA

I'm a little late in getting back, but thank you as well for your help and invaluable information. I'll review the back issues again...

RON.