Major rod finish problem. Before I tell you what the problem is let me assure you that I very carefully follow the same steps for mixing and applying finish each time. I have been using this exact same procedure for years regardless of the brand of finish that I use. I mix the finish in the same glass cup each time. I clean that cup with denatured alcohol each time. I use camel hair brushes and clean them with denatured also. Last week I had to put the first coat of finish on three different rods. The finish went on the thread wraps, bare blank by the signature section and over the vinyl lettering decal. The finish left some huge fish eyes. There was so much bare rod and thread that the finish piled up on itself creating big bumps of finish. On the thread wraps it looked like the finish pulled away from the edges of the thread guide wraps and piled up in the middle. The bare rod blank had very large fish eyes. This was not readily apparent when the finish first went on but did this during the drying process.

I was @#$%&. I got out some old finish (same brand) thinking this batch was contaminated some how. I put this older finish over the first coat and two coats later it was covered, looked better but still wavy. So I called my supplier, they hadn’t heard of any problems. I thought it could be the color preserver (but that shouldn’t affect the bare blank right?) I thought it could be the brushes so I changed camel hair brushes. I scrubbed the glass mixing jar (again). This “bad batch” of finish did not have a production date stamped on it which was odd.

Called the supplier and ordered two new sets of the same finish. Mixed up a batch of the new finish last night, put it on the musky rod, signature section, bare blank, lettering, and thread wraps and have the exact same problem. Is it the finish? I used different colored thread so it can’t be contaminated thread. I am @#$%&. I am scheduled to put on 5 different sessions of rod finish this weekend on three different rods but I can’t keep doing this. The finish looks terrible.

What is going on? I don’t want to buy a different brand, wait a week to get it, and find out I have the same problem because something with my procedure is screwed up or contaminated. Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Buzz

Buzz:
A while back I had a problem like yours , It drove me nuts ! Come to find out the boy's were working on a chain saw IN my rod shop... The air born oil from the mixed gas had settled on ALL of the things in my shop and a weeks worth of cleaning was the only cure, I had to trash a lot of thread and wash down the blanks and clean & clean again..... My rod shop is now locked and no one with out me with them goes in..
You know about air born sprays are bad too.
Just a thought?

Tight Lines
Bill Rice

thanks for the input Bill, Thread is kept in shut plastic boxes in a closed cabinet. The thread that the finish was put on is both regular A and metallic which are kept in two different boxes.

I had the exact same thing happen to me on a butt wrap I did in April. I put 2 coats of finish on it, let it sit for a couple of weeks up in my house out of my shop. Applied the next coat, adn teh disaster occurred. MY problem was caused by one of 2 things:
1. Waited too long between coats of finish. This has never been a problem for me in the past though.
2. Someone sprayed deodorant, or the oil/grease smoke from my overcooking got on the rod.

Buzz, I don't kow what to tell you. Are the blanks cleaned prior to wrapping?

No Billy I don't clean the blanks first. How would i do that? And if I didn't clean the blanks, would that affect those areas with thread wraps? it happened to every wrap, and the bare blank signature section. There is the usual cork dust that falls in my shop but i clean the shop bench and the overhead flor light before applying finish just to make sure I have thedust under control. the blanks in question that I had the problem with were St. Croix blanks, and one Thomas and Thomas.

Thanks for the input Billy.

I can't say for sure that is the problem - it's probably not. Take the blank and finish in which the problem is occuring, and just wipe the blank with Isopropyl alcohol and coat with the finish and see if it happens again. AS far as it affecting teh areas with thread wraps, I would normally say no, it shouldn't, but in this case something did. Or you truly have an issue with that epoxy.

Was the CP on the bare blank as well where the problems are?

Buzz,

Probably not the finish you are using.

Probably some sort of silicon contamination. Anyone in the house (or rod shop) been using polish with a silicon additive, oil like WD-40, cooking spray, other spray oils, or least obvious of all wearing one of those colorful wrist bands everyone wears nowadays that are silicon based? It does not take much to cause fish eyes in the finish.

Get rid of the source of the pollutant and clean up the rod, tools and bench with alcohol.

Joe Douglas

That is a good question. Shop is in my basement and nothing is done there but build rods. I did spray some WD40 away from that area. Perhaps the WD got on the rod blank, then soaked through to the threads as I wrapped them. Can I clean existing thread wraps with denatured alcohol without affecting the thread wraps? i have used denatured to wipe up epoxy spills off of a blank and took the finish off the blank. What should I use to clean a blank and clean some thread wraps?
Buzz

Several years ago I used to give all of my rods a coat of Reel and Line magic after completed. One time I sprayed a couple of rods while several were turning and a couple of hours later the finish had large fisheyes on every guide wrap. I didn't realize at first but it dawned on me later that's what was the cause of my problem, slicone contamination.

The thing that doesn't make sense is that he coated teh rod just fine with another brand of finish. That is what is throwin gme off. If it were SIlicone, it should affect any finish he tries, no?

denatured alcohol - do you refill from a large can? - did you get the right one - check to be sure it is not mineral spirits

I hate to take the time to do this but I am going to do a finish mock up.
I will use a series of different threads on the butt section of a new blank that is still in the bag.
I will use a new brush, new mix container. Same finish. I will use CP and no CP. I will use the "old" finish that I have been using for repairs that didn't cause problems.
I will coat the blank and thread, and bare blank with finish, and see what happens. This isgoing to take 2 or 3 days but I don't know what else to do. I will post my findings on a new thread......... Please keep posting your suggestions.
Thanks
Buzz

My guess is airborne contamination as mentioned before. It sounds as if the blanks themselves got contaminated, that's why the problem is occurring on multiple blanks and in multiple regions with and without thread....

I'm inclined to think that Bill is on the right track . Something in the Alcohol
had same problem, early this year and it was the alcohol or in my case acetone. Turned out the brand I bought hand an addative in it.

I finally have something to contribute! Before becoming a teacher, I was a painting contractor for 19 years. I learned through many expensive episodes that fish eyes only occur when the surface tension on the object being finished is less than that of your finish. the surface tension in your finish prevents the finish from laying out smoothly. Contaminates are sometimes silicones, but furniture polish overspray or some household cleaners can cause problems too. The best solutions in painting always involved vigorous rubbing with some solvent or another. There were some additives for painting that would break the surface tension of your materials, but for this application (rod finishes) I would have to opt for the vigorous cleaning.

Buzz,

I suspect the culprit may be the vinyl lettering. Did you seal it with color preserver or just finish right over the top of it? I have seen this happen before and the stuff on some vinyl lettering is then spread all over the rod.

..........

Just got into this little get together, like all others I have been there and done that. I have found my problems and like Tom says one was the vinyl decals. I lightly wiped them down with denatured alcohol and also the blank it self and no problem again. Another thing mentioned was the alcohol itself....DO NOT buy any products from suppliers that carry their brand names [Ace, Home Depot,K-Mart,Wal-Mart, etc.] you are asking for
trouble they get the dregs of the vats and pass it off as good materials and it is junk...buy only brand names from paint supply stores be it house or auto ONLY. I am not saying this is your problem but it may well be.


Tight Lines
Tight Wraps
Fishin'Stix by Fred

I ALWAYS buy the store brands (Ace mostly.) and have had no problems of any kind. It's the same stuff, just put in private label cans. Read the labels. Very few of the things that we use in rodbuilding, epoxies, finishes, CP's, even tools, are made by the company that sells them. Many are just repackaged in their name containers. Just about every manufacturer out there from tools to food, manufacture's private label products.

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

Buzz,
It may be that the fish eyes showed up everywhere because you had the contaminant on your hands and passed it on to the blank, threads and decal with your hands.
In fact if you had used WD40 somewhere in your shop in the recent past as you say I would bet a nickle that you either got some on the blank or somehow got it on your hands.