I haven’t seen any posts regarding reel weight and its effect on overall rod/reel sensitivity. It is my feeling that the lightest reel possible (less mass) has less of a dampening effect to a rod’s sensitivity. Although I don’t believe that the weight of a casting reel has much, if any, effect on a rods “action”, I do think that because of a spinning reels location (distance from reel seat/moment arm), it’s weight does some effect on the rod’s action.
I’d welcome any of your thoughts as to the effects of reel weight and how it effects SENSITIVITY.

Reel weight has zero effect on rod action. Action is the initial flex profile of the rod and I doubt the weight of the reel can affect that in any way.

As far as sensitivity, damping of any sort has little effect on sensivity in a fishing rod. With the length rods we're talking about and the materials used to make the rods, you'd be hard pressed to keep any input at the tip of the rod from reaching the other end. What you'd be more concerned with is how it affects the strength or amplitude of any introduced signal.

Due to the location of the reel, I'd imagine that it would have no practical effect on rod sensitivity, but I'd have to think about it a bit more.


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When the sun comes up in the west this could turn into this weekends physics lesson! After I clean fish I will revisit and cogitate.

Gon Fishn

Another thought.
Does a reel in which the frame and feet are plastic cause more dampening then a metal framed reel?
Do the reels made of Magnesium and Titanium “affect the strength or amplitude of any introduced signal" less or more then other metals?

Based on a conversation I had with Tom Kirkman. A rod is at its most sensitive state when it is a blank only. Anything we add to that blank (tip, guides, thread, handle, epoxy, etc.), desensitizes the blank in some way.

So it would make sense that even reels to some extent would do the same. Whether it be caused by weight or materials.

Now if it is enough to even be noticed or not, is another question.

The item we'd be talking about in regard to damping is the rod out beyond the reel. The reel is situated too far back to have much effect on the length of rod involved, therefore any damping of that section of rod won't be affected much by the addition of any reel. And, damping and sensitivity are not very closely related in terms of what we consider the major factors in rod sensivity. Keep in mind that few would argue that in general, graphite rods will be more sensitive than glass rods, and yet graphite rods typically damp movement/vibrations much more quickly than glass rods of similar length and taper. What fisherman call "sensitivity" isn't really affected all that much by how well, or how poorly, the rod damps.

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Makes sense to me. Thanks Tom.

Sensitivity is affected, and affected greatly, by the mass density of the item or structure involved. I'll have to step back and try to wrap my mind around how additional weight in the form of an attached reel either affects or doesn't affect, the issue of rod sensivity. Somebody else may have some thoughts in the meantime.

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Thoughts? What's that! I have no mind to wrap but - - If the reel is considered to be a part of the system that the fisherman uses to catch fish then the basic rules of physics, EH bait, would certainly be applicable. Newton's first law states that every body in the universe is attracted to every other body in the universe with a force that is directly proportional to their masses and inversly proportional to the square root of the e between their centers. If things that people call sensitivity impact the rod then they also impact the entire system of which the reel is an integral part. The mass of the reel and the height of the thing has some effect on how the "system" behaves in the physical world. While this system is at rest, zero movement, there would be no component of force, momentum or enertia that would either add to or detract from outside actions. Once an outside force interferes with the rod at rest then what occurs is controlled by the entire system. At present I am quite bummed out on this post - I hope Emory is not sick! This outta get quite good!

Fsh Are In The Grease!

It seems to me that the question is about the "sensitivity" of feeling a bite on the end of your line as opposed to some law of physics. Obviously every effect has a scientific explanation but I'm inclined to discuss this in fisherman's terms. The benefits of fishing with a lighter weight reel are enourmous. First off, it is much more comfortable and the longer your fishing session the greater this advantage
becomes. If you are less tired your senses will be more alert. You will have more strength to fight a large fish if that is applicable to your case.

Getting specific: I enjoy surf casting. This usually means arriving at the beach at dead low tide to read the beach and waiting for the incoming to start fishing. Then, fishing non-stop until the outgoing tide has reduced all action. Then reading the beach again and repeating the cycle. Due to the long drive to the beach I try to fish at least two incoming and outgoing tides.

Any way I can reduce the weight of my rig pays great benefits in comfort and performance; of both the gear and of me. I use the best and lightest weight rods and reels I can afford. The 10' 6" spinnning rod weighs 18 ounces and the reel weighs the same.. minus the line. This is why I am happy to invest in a Van Staal spinning reel.. a VS 200 in this case. Super strong and light and endures all the surf and sand can throw at it without a hiccup.

My spiral casting rig is no less lean and mean. Lighter weight, if it is accompanied with high strength and great engineering makes a winning combination in almost every application from fishing gear to race cars. This is the realm of the high priced offerings as the technology to accomplish this goal gets very intense. Witness CTS blanks, Ross Evolution reels, Waterworks Purist reels, etc.

This discussion on weight considerations is more helpful if focused on the realities of the sportsman's experience rather than the esoteric physical laws. I am certain I feel a strike a lot easier with a light graphite rod than with a heavier stick. I also feel a lot more alert fishing for hours with a rig that is light in my hands than one that would hurt my wrist. I can cast further with it too. This rule applies equally well for every fishing application; from fighting a Giant Blue Fin Tuna with an Accurate two speed reel to playing a brookie with a Ross Evolution 0 weight reel. I seek light and strong every time I can.

Dave

Food for thought: If you were to clamp (or tape) a two or three once weight to one of your reels, would you notice a difference in the rods performance? I know the term “sensitivity” may be subject to interpretation, but without having to get into physics, I think you’d see (or feel) what I mean by adding weight to the reel.
When I started fishing a little over a ½ century ago, I used a “drop line” (no rod or reel) with black braid. While it was difficult to cast, it had unequalled sensitivity. I have found that over the years in building my own rods that even with relatively heavy bass action rods that by keeping the weights of ALL the components down improves the overall “performance” (also subject to interpretation). I have read, on this site, some of the posts regarding the effects of the additional weight of foregrips and even buttwraps and hook keepers and although everyone seems to agree that these components have little effect on rod performance (as opposed to weight toward the rod tip), I haven’t heard of any considerations regarding reel weight. Of course, using a reel is a given, but there are considerable differences in reel weights which I believe makes a significant difference. In addition to the improved dynamics, a lighter reel also has obvious ergonomic advantages.
Anyway, that’s my story and I’m sticking to it.
I respect and appreciate all your opinions.

Where you put the weight has a lot to do with things. I'm inclined to think that a heavy reel would indded tend to reduce sensitivity, but not to the extent that say, adding heavier or more guides out on the tip would. There be a much larger window for you could do at the reel seat, weight-wise, than what you could do further up the rod, and not affect sensitivity to any great degree.

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Bill,
You are so full of c---. I know that you are baiting me but your bait is getting old and stale and does not smell very good.

Dave,
If you think that physics is esoteric think about it like this. With a given amount of energy coming up the line and transferring to the rod, the heavier the rod and reel is the less movement of the rod and reel there will be and movement is what you feel. In other words the less overall weight, rod and reel, the more it will move for a given amount of input energy therefore the higher the sensitivity. Is that less esoteric enough for you?

Emery,
I appreciate your support of my point with the pertinent physics. In my answer to the original question I failed to realize Jim's desire to have the science explained. I thought the question deserved a simple answer adressing the practicalities of the fishing experience. Lighter is better. A lighter rod is more affected by any force applied against it. The most accurate reading of any senations from the line is by holding it between thumb and forefinger. I do this when bait fishing. It's especially effective when fishing the surf.as it makes it easy to distinguish between the effects of the wind and waves from the subtle tap of a fish or the nibble of a crab. The most successful surf fisherman I know keep the rod in hand with at least one finger on the line at all times.

Dave

Funny you should mention that, my dad always fished that way and that was how we were taught as kids. Of course, that was with using bait for bottom fishing. But you definitely felt every "tap."

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I agree with you Dave. It used to be common practice to run the line over the top of the thumb as it came out of the reel while gripping the reel at the foregrip. This allowed direct contact with the line without the “deadening” (better word than “dampening”?) effect of the rod/reel. It was especially effective back in the old days when rods/reels were pretty clunky (another technical term). As I said earlier, I remember fishing with nothing but a “drop line” (no rod/reel) as a kid, and holding the line over my finger…. the ultimate in sensitivity.
However, there are times such as fishing a crankbait, when this may not be as practical and subtle strikes can occur.

Jim,

The reel will act as what's called a mass damper and will affect the sensitivity by reducing the amplitude of vibrations traveling through it (the reel). Interestingly, Mg as a metal has a somewhat higher damping factor than other metals like steel or aluminum, but you gain the advantage of less weight.

This whole idea of damping can get a bit confusing unless you make the distinction between the damping of the material as opposed to the damping of the complete system. Carbon fiber (CF) composites as a materials tend to have much lower damping factors as compared to glass fiber composites. So the CF is measurably more efficient for small scale vibrations and loose less of the input energy.

....BUT the settling time is much shorter for the CF rod, indicating a system that is damped faster. Even though the CF composite has lower damping than a glass composite the rod damps faster. So why is that? The CF composite rod also tends to be much lighter, power for power, and stiffer as well. So then the system with much lower mass and higher stiffness will tend to damp more quickly when it come to larger scale defections.

The reel foot may tend to stiffen the seat area locally, but I agree that the reel will have little to no measurable effect on the overall action of the rod.

mark