Hello

I was wondering if someone could give me some guidance as far as how the concept guide system works when there is no intersection point (http://www.rodbuilding.org/library/newguide.html) when you mount the reel you expect to be using. I have a 6'6" 12-20lb blank. I put the reel I intend on using on it but apparently the reel's midpoint never really intersects withthe rod because the reel foot is somewhat long. Is it ok to use a smaller reel to figure out the correct distances for the guides?

Thanks
Sam

Concept guideing is specific to one reel , or reels of similar measuremnts such as upsweep angle ( which must be non existant to have no intersection point) spool centerline distance away from the blank. Use a 1st guide placement of 19-21" inches away from the spool face. Use high frame guides start with a 25 if a 4000 sized Shimano reel , or a 20 is a 2000, 2500 size. Run three guides back to the blank making a funnel the 4th guide being the intersecting point, ( the guide rings should be visible one inside the other as you sight through them for the funnel guides) use 6's on out to the tip from there

HERE WE GO AGAIN -

Samer Ibrahim - In a word, you will guestimate, discover, generate, impose, create, "wing" or divine a suitable Intersect Point for your particular rod blank's taper and intended style of guides. You will use a combination of common sense; interaction with the rod blank while bending it; and some more "Looks Right To Me" to develop a conspiracy of appropriate design layout. This is NOT an exact science with a unique solution to begin with, so do not lose too much sleep over it.

In my opinion, the Intersect Point should be somewhat forward of where the rod blank starts to deviate noticeably from the lower straight backbone. On your size rod, that is likely to be ~20-24" up from the BUTT Guide. Then everything upward from there toward the rod-tip will be your smaller RUNNING guides.

For a typical 6 foot to 6-1/2 foot Spinning Rod, If you look at the distance from your REEL SPOOL to your ROD-TIP, then:
LOWER-THIRD is REEL SPOOL to BUTT GUIDE - the OPEN Zone
MIDDLE-THIRD is BUTT GUIDE to CHOKER GUIDE - the FUNNEL Zone
UPPER-THIRD is CHOKER GUIDE to TIP-TOP - the RUNNING Zone

Sam, and others - Divest yourself of the impression that the Reel's UPSWEEP ANGLE is an essential or immutable or even significant determination of where the Intersect Point should be. It was a CONVENIENCE instituted to quickly communicate a facil method of guide placement. It has some inherent assumptions about reel sizes and upsweep angles, and every now & then, the limits of those assumptions are encountered. ... I'm sticking to the short version of this can of worms for now. Gotta run.

Search the RBO Archives for
SEARCH = "INTERSECT POINT" --> ALL DATES
SEARCH = "TRIFECTA" MESSAGE BODY + "HALL" AUTHOR
SEARCH = "CAN OF WORMS" MESSAGE BODY + "HALL " AUTHOR

TOM KIRKMAN is, of course, the final authority on his Intersect Method. The only trouble with using his name as the AUTHOR it is that sometimes you get so many hundreds of RETURN RESULTS in a Search that it becomes next to impossible to wade thru and find what you are looking for.

DATES around July-Aug.2005; Dec.2005-Jan.2006; and recently in May-Aug.2006 should prove interesting.

Remember that your STATIC LOAD Test will also influence your guide placement & selection, which is what you are sort of doing by bending the rod blank to determine a good Intersect Point.

Think BIG PICTURE and that will help you, too.
Good Luck & Best Wishes, Sam, ... B)- ... from -Cliff Hall, FL-USA.

Re: Uplifted / angled reels ... Cliff Hall ... 12-03-05 5:21PM
[www.rodbuilding.org]
Rob Heaton - the reel's upweep angle has very little effect on all this. This is a bit of a can of worms. See for yourself. -Cliff Hall+++

Steve Gardner - thanks, that's a simpler way to describe it.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/01/2006 07:08PM by Cliff Hall.

Samer;
Place the blank against a wall and bend the tip out to about 90% from the wall. The point at which the blank starts to lose contact with the wall will be your approximant intersect point

Compromise, adapt, overcome,

Mike, No disrespect intended, but if you are quoting Clint Eastwood, it should be improvise. I agree 100%!!

Bill in WV

Samer, I had the exact same problem as you a few months ago, and posted this: [www.rodbuilding.org]. I followed what Tom recommended (and what Steve Gardner is recommending above), and found the choke point by bending the blank. I can proudly say that I've used that plugging rod many times since, and it's performed excellently.

Looking back, I think now that my concern with finding the exact choke point was a little bit overdone -- getting it in the right vicinity should work fine. Locate it as Steve Gardner suggests above and you should be fine. Good luck.

No disrespect William....Improvise sounds pretty good too!