What is it all about and how should it be checked ? When I built my second rod I was attempting to keep the weight slightly in front of the reel thinking it would assist in loading the tip during the cast. Seems what the rod will be used for would play into it quite a bit maybe even being the more important factor. Maybe another way of asking the same question would be when isnt a rod well balanced?

Good question. Thanks for asking it. I have been pondering the same thing. Hopefully some of the others will provide some insight.

Using a set of line guides with as low a collective mass as your guide layout requires (and your budget can afford), and using a little less thread and epoxy finish, is usually the better way to keep a rod "tip-lite", rather than adding weight in the butt, "after the fact".

Usually a rod that is slightly heavier toward the butt is more comfortable than a "tip-heavy" rod. Especially for longer rods.

A poorly balanced rod is one whose balance distracts your mind or your hands from the confidence it takes to pay attention to and detect hits, and / or annoyingly throws off your timing while casting. ...

As far as I am concerned, if the rod does not cause mis-timing or mis-minding, the dynamic action of the rod is FUNCTIONALLY "balanced", it ain't broke, and I don't fix it.

You are not sitting around, statically holding your rod by one finger while fishing, so be realistic in asking yourself "is it balanced". Imitate the way you hold the rod when casting or fishing. Go thru the motions and sense the "balance" from a FUNCTIONAL stand-point, not just an idle-mode cradling in your hand.

The idle-motion balance point may be 5 inches in front of the reel spool. And that is often, in fact, the case on my rods. But as soon as I put a realistic grasp on the rod, with my fist around the foregrip or under the reel seat, and move the rear grip up into my forearm, the rod is "locked" in place. Then all that care about "finely-tuned balance" is superceded by the strength of the handshake and the blocking action of the forearm.

IMO, the balance should be under WHERE YOU HOLD THE ROD WHILE FISHING. For small rods, that is likely right AT the reel foot. For my salt-water fishing, I very often prefer to hold the rod at the FOREGRIP. So, all of a sudden, a balacne point 5 inches in front of the reel spool may not be such a bad thing.

IMO, there are so many different types of rods and anglers that I would not generalize much further.

If you have to add weight to the butt, it may balance the rod. But a lighter overall rod weight may be more comfortable than a finely balanced rod in the long run. ...

It's really all up to your specific taste and situation.
IMO, -Cliff Hall



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/23/2006 10:34AM by Moderator.

Hi Tom,Leon,
I am pretty picky about the balance of rods and if at all possible work with anyone I am building a rod for to set it up just how they like rods to balance. This really can vary from person to person, some liking a little more weight toward the tip and some like more toward the end cap. Adding as little weight to the rod is also important but with longer rods sometimes some weight will have to be added to the end cap because the rear grip can only be so long and still be comfortable to cast. The link is to a picture of a rod that I balanced for myself and feel that it is extremely sensitive for a fiberglass rod.
[www.fishingphotos.net]



Tight wraps and lines,
Wylie

There is a long thread from a while back that looks at several sides to this question. Do a search on it. Good opinions both for and against.

Cliff really good reply! Good info.

For myself I am a bass fisherman and use technique specific rods most of the time. So depending on what I am doing with a rod, will determine how I balance it. For rods that I build for crank baiting, Spinner baiting, top water, stick bait's, extra. I generally hold my rod at about the 4 to 5 o’clock position so I don’t worry about them being a little tip heavy.

For worms, Sinko’s, jigs, drop shoting, and other slack line techniques . I always build/balance those rods tip light.
Personally I prefer a negative balance at the tip. That way, at least for me. Even if I don’t feel the initial strike. I feel even the most subtle down ward pulling of a fish moving off with my bait.

Tom,
Loading the rod is primarily a function of the weight that is added near the tip of the rod and weight added at the butt of the rod will have very little effect on rod loading. This is because the weight, actually mass, turns into inertia when in motion and the more weight and the higher the velocity the higher the inertia and therefore the higher the loading. The weight of the guides and wraps particularly those near the tip of the rod plus the line and any additional weight in lure or bait will determine the loading because at the tip is where the higher velocity will be.
I am not a big believer in statically balancing the rod with added weight in the butt because I do not believe that it will improve how the rod will perform dynamically or in actual use. In terms of the performance of any rod that will be used to cast with I think that the less weight that is added to the rod the better.

Tom,
I'm with Emory here. Years ago I messed around with the balancing of rods. Tried long handles, adding weight, etc. I couldn't say it made a positive difference. Some of the long handled rods shorter rods I built balanced beautifully and were very sensitive. They just didn't fish very well.
That said, never hurts to do your own experimenting, and half of sucessful fishing at least is confidence. You can do a lot of experimenting with a little masking tape, etc and modify and mess around till you get the combo you like, then build it.

Ive only just finished my 2nd rod the first being a casting and the second a spinning. I never really considered adding weight but relied upon a combination of guides (used Rec on both) and reel seat positioning. As Spence mentioned trying various arrangements using masking tape to determine where everything should be to create the "right' feel seemed to be the key. I found that the static placement of the guides pretty much left reel position as the primary adjustment for "balance". I would call mine "tip moderatly light" as when I tie on a Case 6" worm and an 1/8 oz slider and gripping as to cast there is no noticeable front or rear bias. If you balanced it on your finger (maybe 2" in front of the reel seat stem,rigged with worm and weight the tip might drop just a little. It throws well and I feel confident that the worm will land where I need it to makes me think that I have it properlyu balanced.
Steve's emphasis on what your using for bait and how your going to fish it makes a lot of good sense. Lots of interesting comments and thanks for all.

I would be a bit careful with moving the reel and checking how the rod "feels". If you move the reel seat forward you are shortening the portion of the rod that is vibrating when you shake it. Shortening the rod will increase the resonant frequency which will result in the rod "feeling" crisper or more responsive and the opposite when you move the reel seat back toward the butt of the rod. Moving it back will result in the vibrating portion of the rod being longer with a lower resonant frequency which will make it "feel" less crisp and responsive.

I build mostly bass rods, and I've come to the following conclusion regarding balancing. On everything but pitching/flipping rods, I try to make the rod as light as possible. Not only do I not add weight, but I also remove as much weight as possible, using very little cork, split seats, no foregrip, titanium guides, etc.

However, on pitching/flipping rods, I do add some weight to the butt. But, I only add enough to make the balance neutral. Practically, this means that the actual balance point ends up right at the reel or slightly in front of it. I find that this is enough to overcome the fatigue that heavy 7' (or longer) rods tend to cause. But, it's not enough to affect the rod in any other way.

Andrew,
You make a very good point. On pitching and flipping rods because of the way that they are used a little extra weight is not going to have as much of a negative effect on the rods performance as with other types of casting rods.
But these rods are typically already pretty heavy in addition to being tip heavy. It seems to me that the added weight that will be necessary to bring the balance point all of the way back to reel is going to be quite a bit of weight to add to many of these already heavy rods.

Andrew/Emory
Pitching/flipping sticks are the number one rod I balance. I have added as much as 2.5 ounces to the butt to obtain neutral balance. Yes I know that is excessive. But for me and some times I flip 7 or 8 hours a day, the lack of fatigue in my wrist is worth the added weight .

One way I have been able to cut way down on that weight is to go to one piece 8’ flipping sticks instead of telescoping blanks. It cuts about 30% off the total weight of the blank and has allowed me to cut about 90% off the balancing.

The over lapping of the two parts in front of the handle moves a lot of weight forward. One piece blanks have also allowed me to move my larger guides a little closer to the handle. Which also moves some of the weight closer to the butt. Again aiding in balance. With out having to worry about the rod’s the lower section hitting the first guide, it provides me a little more room to play

Steve,
I think that you are right on target by going to a much lighter a one piece blank. The only reason for the heavier two piece that I can see is short rod lockers in boats. I have built quite a few of the two piece when I could not talk someone out of them but every one I built seemed like a real club to me.