Ok. Oh, yeah, hi everyone. Here we go.

I am thinking of going to glass or ceramic bowls for mixing epoxy, and a glass stir stick. Heat in basement, cured. Humidity, cured. Bubbles, cured. Craters and fisheyes in wrap finish, still present. If Tom would refrain from editing out my cursing, you would read what a west pac sailor can say when the situation warrents. Now, do you think this would help? I use wood stir sticks now, and plastic cups. I could place glass or ceramic on an electric stove. How do I sand out the problems, without blowing the blank? I don't want to dig into the thread, the finish is so thin you can see the thread pattern, it is hard, I went an 1/8th inch past with the epoxy and there are some small areas where the finish did not take. I am now typing very fast, and need to look at the keyboard less and less. I just dont know. The finish should be smooth, and thick and glossy. I am getting perturbed. Levi

The only thing that I know that causes the fisheyes is something on the thread. Even oil from your fingers will casue problems.

I mix my epoxy in a plastic cup and the end of an old disposable brush pour it out on some tin foil and let it spread out to release some of the bubbles.

I also make sure that neither I nor anyone else touches the threads after the CP, the oils in your skin will repel the finish, I made that mistake in the past. Also you may be brushing it on too thin. I use a brush to apply my epoxy, but I littoraly scoop it out and dribble it on the threads. I use the brush to smooth it over lengthwise but I more or less just kinda push it where I want it to go and take the lumps off, I really don't brush it. I then hit it with a bit of heat to release bubbles and turn by hand for while and take care of the sagging.

Levi,
What brand of thread did you use? Some brands have a coating of silicone which causes fish eyes.Wood stir sticks can cause more bubbles go with another type. I would refrain from putting rod finish on the stove as the heat will reduce the pot life and you could also cause a FIRE! If your finish is as severe as you sound you need to re-wrap.

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..

Simple answer: Go to the Flexcoat link - read instructions - follow instructions - problem solved.

Gon Fishn

I use wood popcycle sticks and plastic pill cups for mixing epoxy. I don't pour it out on anything. I finish when it's raining hard outside and the humidity is high inside. I finish while turning cork and other wood items. I always get a very nice, hard, glassy, smooth epoxy finish coating. In fact, I find it's extremely hard to mess an epoxy job up. The stuff just insists on leveling, setting and curing perfectly.

Almost every rod builder that has ever watched me apply finish, will make some comment pertaining to the fact that I do almost nothing with it. "You don't torch it?' "You're not going to pour it out on foil?" "You're not going to rotate it?" "You're not going to dab a little more in there?" The list goes on.

I have become convinced that most epoxy problems are due to the builder trying to do too much instead of just letting the epoxy do what it wants to do naturally.

In an earlier post, you mentioned that you were using two part epoxy adhesive as a finish. Have you acquired some actual epoxy thread finish since then? Let's cover that before moving on to other possible problems.

...............

I aggree with Tom, the more I futz with it the worse it gets.I also don't don't use a dryer anymore, that thing just allowed me to put more epoxy on than needed to do the job and then kept it from leveling very well.

Same here! I have numerous dryers and rarely use them. The difference between hand drying and power drying is surprising!! Levi, I'm curious, why would you heat finish on a stove??
Not sure, but I don't know what the advantage, if any, that glass stirrers/cups, etc. would make. I've used popsicle sticks, toothpicks, coffee stirrers, wood, plastic with no difference in the results. I'm thinking of going to a shot glass simply because I sometmes find I am out of plastic cups when I need them and the shot glass would be easily wiped out with alcohol.

If you are using an actual rod finish and it is "fish eyeing", I would think that something is repelling the finish. You should be able to tell if your thread has a coating that is causing it by doing a test wrap and use CP (which will seal any coating) and finish it



Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

Mike:
what is the difference between hand drying and power drying?
How much do you want for a dryer?

I'm a proponent of the "Kirkman school" I guess... Sampled several different brands of finish... settled on the one that works best for me (RodSmith)... I use a glass shot glass and a Flexcoat plastic (PVC) stir stick (used a little garnet paper to polish the tip)... I put the epoxy bottles in my pocket for ten minutes to bring it up to body temp... mix it until it looks clear... pour it out on a piece of 4-inch square glossy white bathroom tile (put a cork bottom on the tile so it doesn't slide around)... After I pour it out, I blow on it once or twice and watch the bubbles disappear... I apply it with the pointed end of a plastic collar stave (that's right, a plastic collar stave... it's my favorite applicator tool after having tried metal and plastic artist spatulas, various brushes, credit cards, knitting needles, etc.)... one thin coat... let it dry... then a second more robust coat... then I LET THE EPOXY DO IT'S THING... no torches... no alcohol lamps... no BIC lighters... no blow dryers... no voo doo chanting... I turn the sections for several hours with an 18 rpm motor... great results every time... LET THE EPOXY WORK... DON'T PLAY WITH IT... Easy clean up with 70% alcohol... wipe out the shot glass, wipe off the ceramic tile, the stir stick, and the collar stave...

Levi, I forget who posted this quote, but it's a good one to add to what every one else has said here; "It's not how much epoxy you put onto the thread, it's how much you take off."

Get it on - a nice, thick coat, then remove the excess from the underside of the rod as it sags, as you watch for any bubbles. The only thing to do once you've removed the excess is to ensure there's no bubbles.

As far as the fisheyes go, like said, too little finish WILL create this problem all by itself. If that's NOT the case, ensure that your hands are clean when you start wrapping, and clean them fairly frequently during wrapping. NEVER handle a blank without having cleaned your hands first. After those problems are solved and if you still have fisheyes, it's something in the basement that's contaminating as airborne... and that's another story completely.

A quick first coat of Permagloss may help you out, then follow with a coat of 2 part epoxy rod finish (thanks for the idea, Stan Grace).

Putter
Williston, ND

I finish on the same desk my computer is on and when the rod is drying I'm paying bills, playing games, reading the forum all while th rod is practically in my lap. I did get fisheyes a couple times, but it was on the first wrap that I applied finish to. What I do now is on the first time I fill the brush with epoxy, I clean it off the brush with a clean paper towel and then fill it again. I haven't had fisheye problems since.

My point is, contamination can come from anything or anywhere. What's touching the threads as you're wrapping? What did you wipe the blank with? What's on your brush that you put CP on with, if you use that? You have to lookat everything.

I had a revelation a short time ago. I did some test wraps on a blank that I hadn't used before, a funny gray color blank, and when I coated the wraps, I didn't really care how they came out. I wasn't careful with measuring or mixing, didn't care how much I touched the blank or thread, put too much coating on the wraps, didn't turn it often enough. Yeah, they came out better than anything I'd done so far.

Dave

I usually wash my hands, but I work with so many chemicals I am sure I cant get them really clean without sanding. My hands and arms ALWAYS look dirty. I am using gudebrod cp thread, black and grey on the rod I am about to screw up. I have my underwraps on, and that is where the problems arose, at the very end of the wraps, where the epoxy is in a solid ring on the blank. I am using high build flex coat, Tom. Randy, I put that first coat on thin, and removed excess as well. I will try to put on a nice thick coat. I thought about the heat because it's cold! I got it up around 65 or 70 degrees now, should be ok. It's clean, I used a 600 grit paper to scuff the finish, its been on the underwraps over a week. It's all taped off and ready to go. Tommorrow I will put the finish on, and hope for the best. Oh, and they are two foot guides, I think I will apply the epoxy , then spin. Last time I tried this with two foot guides it looked like junk. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Thanks for the help, guys, your advice has definitly lead to a cleaner basement, if nothing else. Levi

I usually wash my hands, but I work with so many chemicals I am sure I cant get them really clean without sanding. My hands and arms ALWAYS look dirty. I am using gudebrod cp thread, black and grey on the rod I am about to screw up. I have my underwraps on, and that is where the problems arose, at the very end of the wraps, where the epoxy is in a solid ring on the blank. I am using high build flex coat, Tom. Randy, I put that first coat on thin, and removed excess as well. I will try to put on a nice thick coat. I thought about the heat because it's cold! I got it up around 65 or 70 degrees now, should be ok. It's clean, I used a 600 grit paper to scuff the finish, its been on the underwraps over a week. It's all taped off and ready to go. Tommorrow I will put the finish on, and hope for the best. Oh, and they are two foot guides, I think I will apply the epoxy , then spin. Last time I tried this with two foot guides it looked like junk. Nothing ventured, nothing gained. Thanks for the help, guys, your advice has definitly lead to a cleaner basement, if nothing else. Levi