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Grouper rod
Posted by:
Mike Barkley
(---.nap.wideopenwest.com)
Date: December 01, 2005 06:48PM
Guy brought 2 6' solid fiberglass rods that he uses for grouper and wants me to convert it to a spinning rod. My question is - these rods are 47" frpm end of foregrip tp tip and have only 3 guides plust tip. He still wants only 3 guides only larger to use the rod with a spinning reel. Since we have very few grouper in Michigan, I haven't a clue. Just doesn't look right to me!
What size type guides would work? Mike (Southgate, MI) If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!! Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
bill boettcher
(---.an2.nyc41.da.uu.net)
Date: December 01, 2005 07:38PM
if you have the reel you could use larger high " V "type casting guides. Maybe the first a 30 ? Depending on the reel he will use. Then taper them down to a size tip for the line he will use.
Yea a wood uni-butt handle and probable a white blank? Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
Billy Vivona
(---.nycmny.east.verizon.net)
Date: December 01, 2005 08:00PM
If the guy is from Florida, he probably wants those goofy Non Fouling Chrome guides. I am not familiar with them at all, but I do know they are extremely popular down there.
Mike - sometimes we're asked to do things outside of our capabilities. Other times we're asked to do things that make you scratch your head and wonder why you are bothering. PErsonally, I would give teh blanks back & let someone else handle it. Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
Cliff Hall
(---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: December 01, 2005 08:31PM
FUJI BNLG 40, 25, 16 + 12-16MM TIP-TOP. If he uses knotted leader material or swivel connections, go for the large ring TIP-TOPs and think RST or UST for a Tip-Top. This guy sounds like a meat fisherman, no fairy wands and no catch & release B.S. Casting distance is NOT an issue. Watch your LOAD test. Think POOL CUE, and that'll work. Short grouper rods are all about the meat. Yank & crank. Snatch & winch. You have ~ 5 seconds to win the battle, or (s)he's gone -Cliff Hall+++, Gainesville, FL-USA.
[I think all big grouper are females. All the smaller grouper are males. and then they turn into females as they get older, or something like that. Scary stuff. Thank God that ain't me ! –LOL-!!!] Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
Cliff Hall
(---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: December 01, 2005 08:43PM
P.S. - SOLID GLASS rod blanks is almost always the sign of a no-nonsense sinker-bouncing meat fisher. Go RUGGED and functional, and he will go for it. If he wants something fancy, that you will surely be able to come up with. I would NOT recommend Foulproofs, because of the rust propensity. I friend of mine who never rinses his tackle proved me right when I told him "DON'T", and he went Foulproof, and rust is the norm after the third trip. ... If you warrant it, you'll be eating the rust.
Okay, Vivona - A solid glass rod is OFTEN the sign of a serious meat fisherman. Not always, But, as you say, Billy, a spinning rod would be a bit odd for a bottom fishing meat -fisherman. And he would be someone I would usually stay at least TWO casts away from, ... LOL! Every time he lets line out, his sinker flies away like a parachute, as the bail lets out 5 times as much slack line as he needs to keep a tight line. Of course, it's always "Hey, who's got my line?!" when ding-a-ling thinks he has a bite, and finds out otherwise. Of course, it's everybody else's fault when he snags and tangles the whole side of the boat. And, of course, meathead expects you to cut your line so he can hurry up and re-rig and not miss any more time on this drop, ... Right, Billy, ... ? ... LOL, all that just from SEEING a guy who is using a spinning reel aboard a party (head) boat. BAD OMEN - steer clear - stay away. "-Here-comes-Jonah-!" Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 12/03/2005 12:28PM by Cliff Hall. Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
Billy Vivona
(---.nycmny.east.verizon.net)
Date: December 02, 2005 07:59AM
Cliff Hall Wrote:
------------------------------------------------------- > P.S. - SOLID GLASS rod blanks is almost always the > sign of a no-nonsense sinker-bouncing meat fisher. Howeveer, a spinning rod might prove otherwise. Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
warren commander
(---.pn.at.cox.net)
Date: December 02, 2005 07:57PM
Cliff, Billy is dead on about the Foul Proof guides here in Florida, and especially here on the Gulf Coast. The ones you mentioned that rusted, were they stainless? What if you washed them off after use, will they still rust? I picked up a set to put on a GUSA 8' 6" MegaMag for cobia. Sounds like I should reconsider. Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
Cliff Hall
(---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: December 03, 2005 02:41AM
Warren - Those guides that rusted on my friend's rod were chrome-plated, coiled, heavy-duty wire. One continuous spin of wire from foot to foot, twice around to form the ring. EXACTLY which brand they were, I can not be sure. I used the name "Foulproof" because I didn't think that anybody but Aetna (?) made them. I am so un-fond of them that I lost track of the brand-specifics. It seems that every rod I have ever seen with coiled wire guides USED IN SALTWATER has had rust on them at the heel of the guide foot going into the epoxy AND in-between the adjacent coils in the ring. Lots of reasons that rust could be there, from user neglect, to product inferiority. "Rust never sleeps" and seems to be contagious, so I avoid it at all costs. ... Ceramic rings for me, ... IMO.
Wire coil guides seem to fair just fine on FRESHwater rods. And I suppose IF YOU WASHED THEM after EACH saltwater trip, that wire coil guides can be kept in good condition on a saltwater rod. But it just seems that the fishers who think that a wire coil guide is indestructible mechanically make the mistaken assumption that the wire is also corrosion-PROOF. It is corrosion RESISTANT, not -PROOF, and with PROPER care may be almost corrosion "proof". BUT anybody who has ever seen a chrome bumper rust on a car or truck driven over salted winter roads knows that chrome can rust. And chrome over brass reel seats can get corrosion on the barrel, or on the outside of the hoods, or especially between the hood and barrel. With some brands of heavy-duty wire coil guides, the last time I looked, it was hard to tell if they electro-plated the chrome onto the base metal before or AFTER the coil was formed. If chrome-plated BEFORE the wire is coiled: chrome is very rigid and does not flex readily, requiring a thinner plating --> earlier saltwater penetration thru thin coating or micro-fractures formed during coiling. If chrome-plated AFTER the wire is coiled: the area where the adjacent coils of wire form the guide ring and touch together is VERY difficult to get the chrome into, and any shearing flexing between those coils can crack the chrome union ("tent"). BIngo --> saltwater intrusion --> rust. Even a little corruption spreads spontaneously and irreversibly. In either scenario of chrome-plating, an inferior product, hard use or user neglect will give saltwater the little advantage it needs to begin the rusting process and change the smoothness and or strength of the guide. That's my assessment as a fisherman, my observations as a rod-builder, and my insight as a professional chemist (B.S.). We don't have to be metallurgists or material (ceramic) scientists to see why ceramic guides have long-ago displaced chrome & wire guide rings, and continue to dominate the market today, even with some newer unplated metals for the wire rings. (RECOILS are probably a great choice for light-duty freshwater applications. BUT the context of this discussion is a medium-heavy++ SALTWATER rod for grouper. The very fact that the guide ring is formed by two coils of wire makes the perfect crevice into which saltwater can dry and start the corrosion process. I don't care what the outer metal of the guide ring is made out of. It's gonna rust. Eventually. Period. And that goes for "stainless steel", too. Unless that metal is titanium or gold or platinum, the dang thing is gonna rust when the saltwater dries. No metals (mechanically suited to make guide rings) are more noble than these against a highly concentrated saltwater solution. A corrupting type of electrolysis will occur no matter what the product description says. That's just straight electro-chemistry and the Nernst Equation.) Warren - you asked: "The ones you mentioned that rusted, were they stainless? What if you washed them off after use, will they still rust? I picked up a set to put on a GUSA 8' 6" MegaMag for cobia. Sounds like I should reconsider." Warren, I don't know what brand of guide you bought, and it probably doesn't matter. IF you take care of it, you should be fine. Rinse it, sponge soap it, toothbrush the inside and outside crevice in the guide ring, rinse it, drain it and then towel dry the ring. Or at least whack the rod against your palm to shake off the water, and towel dry if you can. If you do all that, you should be fine. If you do something less than that, and how much less, I don't know, you increase your chances for rusting CONSIDERABLY. IMO, the one, very simple thing that can be done to prevent corrosion that can make all the difference in the world, is to do this: use a CLEAN TOWEL or WASHCLOTH to DRY the guide feet and rings BEFORE the saltwater can evaporate. ... BEFORE the rod leaves the fishing grounds at the end of the day. Before the rod leaves the party boat. Before you trailer your boat and start driving home. Before you throw the rods in the car or truck. Before you get home and are too tired for all that clean-up. Just DRY the SALTWATER OFF the metal parts of your fishing rod BEFORE the saltwater can get concentrated, and LONG before it can form damp salt crystals. If there is no water and no salt there, because you rinsed it off and / or dried the saltwater off the metals with a towel, you have eliminated ~95% of the source of the corrupting electrolysis. One little clean washcloth stuffed in your tacklebox or stowed dry on your person is all it takes to dry a couple of rods. Doing SOMETHING EARLY to remove the saltwater and to prevent its concentration is much better than doing too little too late. IMO, ... (And it works on hooks, lures, plugs, swivels, stainless leaders, knives, pliers, etc. ... It's the "kill it before it grows" principle.) Warren, Let me know how you like that GUSA MegaMag when you get it going. Thanks, - [ cmkmhall@ufl.edu ] . 'Hope that helps. -Cliff Hall+++, Gainesville, FL-USA+++ Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
warren commander
(---.pn.at.cox.net)
Date: December 03, 2005 04:42PM
Cliff, that helps a lot. Thank you. Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
Billy Vivona
(---.nycmny.east.verizon.net)
Date: December 03, 2005 11:40PM
Warren - I agree with what CLiff ays above. PErsonaly I wouldn't use those guides - I wouldn't even think they existed had I not gone into some of the tackle shops & fish with gus from the Palm Beach area the past couple of years.
GUSA 85 Mega Mag is a SWEET blank. I use the 80 Mega for Bottomfishing up here in NY, and it is teh ideal blank for me & now a few of my customers/friends. I'd love to be able to use it on big fish like you're going to. Re: Grouper rod
Posted by:
Mike Barkley
(---.nap.wideopenwest.com)
Date: December 03, 2005 11:48PM
Guys, Thanks for the help!!
Billy, I'm with you on it not really being worth it, but this guy owns over 50 rods and gives me a lot of repair business so I figured I'd humor him Mike (Southgate, MI) If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!! Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
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