Your thread was contaminated and thus the cp did not fully seal the thread. The contaminant could very well have been already on the blank already when you wrapped the threa, or may have been transferred there when the thread was handled.

With cp turning my black nylon green, and the blotching of light colors, and the dark spots you describe here, I went to not using cp at all anywhere on the rod. The problems went away.

Lou

Let's see - Silicone is a contaminant, probably the worst offender. Polyneon is treated with Silicone. CP over PolyNeon = no problem with the Silicone. Unless the contaminant you have prevented the CP from sticking to teh threads in one spot on this one rod? CP failure, in one single spot on a rod - I doubt it, I would think it's more than likely user error. I'm sure others think the same thing, but don't want to offend you so they tell you what you want to hear. Each of the time sI had problems, it was my fault for one reason or the other, never the fault of CP. Not once.

The pics will be hard to take & show what went wrong. If you really want to frustrate yourself, put the flash on and look at the picture - the blotches won't be there any more. Looking foward to see if you can capture the blotches in a photo, the few times I had these I couldn't get a clear pic.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Here is a link to the picture of the blotch in the butt wrap before I cut it off.

When I cut it off the area that was blotchy still had a discoloration but much less so and was abit stiffer from the epoxy filling the threads. The same area on the blank looks pretty much the same are the rest of.

I know that I had good coverage on the CP, so I have to assume that something keep it from sealing the threads in that area. Two things come to mind.
1. I didn't clean the blank as well as I think Mike posted.
2. I did let a few people handle the rod before it was completed, and of course they probably touched the thread.
I don't think the CP itself failed, I tend to think something got on the threads that kept the CP from them sealing properly.

Lessons learned from this, don't assume that the blank is clean, and don't let people touch unfinished threadwork.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

That's odd. That's not light thread over dark thread, thats' also not a CP issue, or it would've blotched all over. THat's also a VERY dark blotch compared to the ones I got. When you cut this off, see if the finish cam eoff the blank. IF t's not that, then it's defiantely a contaminat that didn't allow the CP to soak into the thereads - I thought CP soaked into everything since it cuts through SIlicone like nothing.

Scott - we posted at the same time.

Scott, do us a favor - make a test wrap on a spare blank, long like 12". In one spot put a drop of olive oil, WD-40, or some other oil. Put a drop of the wood sealer, if you have Silicone or somethign like that (parrifin wax?) - put a drop of that on there too. CP (2 coats), adn put finish over it - see if you can duplicate the problem you got in the wrap.

Oil will probably change teh color of the thread off the bat, but the others might not. IT would be iunteresting to see if the CP is able to soak into teh threads with these contaminants purposely placed on teh threads. IF it does, you know you didn't CP as well as you think - if you get a blotch matchin the wrap - you found the source..or a possible source.

Looks like a dirty finger all right ??!! Get your compliments next time after it is completed.

Yeah the blank looks fine. Can even see the outline of the threads throught CP that got on the blank. I think Bill is correct. I had a few other spot on the guide wraps that did the same thing.

Billy if I get a chance I will see if I can replicate the problem. Maybe a sweaty oily finger print too:) I used be a machinist and when we were turning anything that we needed to have a filed or polished finish on it you learned in hurry that a finger print wouldn't polish or file off. You learned to keep your slimy finger fingers off until you were done. Something with the acids in the oils we ooze from out skin. I guess the same thing applies here:)

Well if you thing about it, how many people when during a day of shopping or traveling around stop in a john and wash there hands ?? Then they look at your rod and of course have to touch it .

Scott, I really feel your pain now. That is a very nice wrap job. Looks like a great grip too. Looking forward to final pics of this one!

Scott - it may very well be a fingerprint - but when you do these wraps do you wash your hands each time you touch a thread? I rarely ever wash my hands before wrapping, and I put my hand, palm, etc all over my wraps, I never had something like that happen. SOmeone had a REALLY nasty finger, lol.

Was anyone playing with reels before they touched teh wrap? Maybe reel grease or bearing oils got on their fingers & that's what did it.

I'm very anal when it comes to clean fingers before and during wrapping. Long time habit. Is it required? I'm not sure. Just for giggles though, I'm going to run some wraps today and introduce some common contaminates (Nose oil, chicken grease, reel oil, etc...) and see what happens with and without CP after finishing. Now I have something reasonably productive to do while watching football.

I am VERY fussy about my fingers being clean when wrapping. The only time I touch a reel is to put a reel in the reel seat to be sure of my guide alignment. It could have also be something on the rod, I have not been real good about cleaning them before wrapping. As a matter of fact about half of the rods I have done have been on blanks that I bought un-sanded and sanded and then used a spray urethane on, and considering that I am kinda fussy they don't get any foreign contaminants on them prior to wrapping.

Really hard to pin point what caused the CP to not seal, only guessing. And other people handling the thread and not starting out with a really clean blank are the only thing that I can say are different than what my normal procedure would be.

Mick,
Have you completely lost it?? What could possibly be more productive than watching football?????



Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

Scott - a few of us who have had this blotching problem with our wraps haven't come to a definitive answer on it either. IT seems each time it happens it's somethign else - this here is completely different than the problems we've had with ligh tthreads over dark, not packing tight enough, CP too thick when applied, too much thread tension, etc.

Mick - it should be really, really interesting to see the results. I'll go out on a limb, and state that once hte CP is applied, the threads are sealed. If there is any discoloration it will be there prior to CP. I hope I'm wrong, and one of those contaminates turn blotchy like Scott's wrap, because that @#$%&.

Scott - tomorrow I'll post a picture for ou of a wrap I cut off yesterday AM, so you won't feel bad. No contaniants, just got 2 1/2 hours into teh wrap and decided I didn't like it so I cut it off. I also got lost for the first time while doing a wrap. REturning from a bathroom break I actually sat there for 20 minutes to try and figure out where I was. That really stunk.,

Mike,
Normally I would agree with you but all I have is the New England game. I normally wouldn't even bother watching but it is turning out to be a good game. I love watching NE lose. hahaha.

I have a dark blue blank wrapped with 521 medium grey and pressed the thread in spots after wiping my fingers on my greasy nose, some reel oil, a piece of fried chicken, and some potato chips. flex coat CP on half of each (I can't find my glass coat CP). I'll get some low build put on in a couple of hours.

Billy
I guess the memory is the first thing to go LOL

Billy, I don't even have to take a break to lose my place in a wrap:) I have a spreadsheet that I put a dash on for every pass of every color as I go. Pretty simple and it works. I just start a new line for every new sequence of the pattern, alway know where I left off.

Bill - if you saw what I was doing, you'd understand why teh confusion. It was a double Snowflake, with the colors reversed on each axis. So wrap A was Tan inner box, GReen outer, B was Green cross, Tan outer. Next pass A was Green outside of the Tan, Tan outside of teh Green. B was Tan outside teh GReen, Green outside the Tan. 2 bands of Tan, followed by a Black thread, and 4 bands of GReen. I was fine until I walked away - yo'll see the pictures tomorrow.

Mick - Loooking foward to teh results of your test.

Scott - I have a spreadsheet & an entire way to plan butt wraps pamphlet which I'll be selling in Charlotte, amongst a few otehr pamplets with new wraps, and instructions on etc's of wrapping. I usually use that, but I woke up at 3:30AM and could't go back to sleep, so I started the above wrap off the top of my head at 4:30AM on a Saturday morning. Not a good idea, lol.

It's not that Billy.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/19/2005 04:51AM by bill boettcher.

Well, I just blew my own theory out of the water. At first, all the oils turned the thread darker. Those dark spots, with and without CP, after a coat of high build, are now much lighter in color than the rest of the thread. Interestingly enough, the area that I first layed down a "rope" of finish before pulling it around, is darker than the rest of the wrap, and where the edge of it was, is nearly black. All I can do right now is look at it and shake my head.