Thanks for the help guys. Tons of great info and some definitely over my head. I'll give a call to some of the manufacturers and ask about the CCF value or stiffness to weight ratio. What does CCF stand for anyways?

Guess sensitivity is definitely hard to measure, due to the large number of factors, esp in the store prior to purchase.

What do you guys think of a Daiwa Light and Tough rod due to it's materials and workmanship:

High modulus IM6 HSD graphite (Anyone know what HSD means?)
Genuine Fuji aluminum oxide guides
Powermesh wrap
Exposed blank in the custom reel seat
blank through handle

Thanks again.
Bill

At the top left in the sponsors' column, click on CCS Data Site; it should help you out on the terminology and measurements on rods and rod blanks.

Putter
Williston, ND

Bill,

IM6 would not be considered High Modulus by any means
Aluminum Oxide are the cheapest guides (nothing wrong with them, though)
Exposed reel seats are not expensive
I can't think of any spinning/casting rods that aren't "blank through handle"
Have no idea what a "powermesh" wrap is. Sounds like marketing hype to me. A wrap is a wrap is a wrap.........

I'm not familiar with that particular rod but sounds pretty much like an ordinary "off shore produced" rod. What kind of price is it??

Mike

According to guys who've used it, it matches the IMX series in terms of sensitivity. It's about $119-129 and feels really light. I want to use it for worming with senkos, bass jigging, and walleye jigging. Something really light and sensitive yet with enough backbone for a good hookset. My only concern was the sensitivity.

Not that IM designations mean anything but I've heard that Loomis and St.Croix don't list their IM's because they are all IM6s. What makes them different is their components. Anyone know if this is true?

Emory, I'd expect a frequency shift since the natural frequency of the Ti section should be quite a bit different than the CF composite.

Bill, CCF refers to Common Cents Frequency (measurement).

I agree with Mike's comments on the IM6 and the guides. The Daiwa Tough and Light rods were discontinued, but brought back recently by a very popular demand for the used rods over the past few years. Used TLs were selling for quite a bit more than retail on the net.

The Power Mesh is a woven reinforcement in the blank, acting somewhat like an outer scrim to give toughness. HSD refers to the term High Structural Density. The idea with HSD is that they have significantly increased the fiber density in the composite, which will theoretically make the blank lighter for comparable power, and more sensitive. The T&L handle and seat designs are somewhat unique as well. The seat has an unusual double cutout to increase the contact area with the blank.

Hope that helps,

mark

Thanks Mark. You seem to know a lot about the Tough and Light rods. What do you think about them, as factory built rods? Good buy for $120 or are there other rods you would recommend for that money? I was also looking at the Fenwick Techna Av's, HMG, HMX, and Airrus rods.

Mark,
Yes, I understand but if both the graphite and the titanium have relatively high Q and the natural frequencies of the two are relatively far apart, which I think is the case, then there should be high attenuation of the vibration if the vibration is close to a sine wave. If the vibration is more complex containing a broad spectrum of sine waves then the attenuation could be less but still fairly high and then there may also be a frequency shift. Don't you agree???
But I do not see how there can be a frequency shift unless there is a frequency component very close to the natural frequency of the titanium already in the vibration that is in the graphite. That was my point about the vibration being a sine wave or more complex and containing additional frequency components.

I think that the issue of whether or not the vibration is a sine wave is key. I would argue that if the graphite and the titanium both have high Q then nothing other than a sine wave will propagate down them. Which means that even if the initial vibration is not a sine wave the graphite and/or the titanium will quickly turn the vibration into a sine wave, in other words all higher or lower frequency components will be filtered out.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/15/2005 12:08PM by Emory Harry.

Emory, Yes I agree. My thought is that when you pulse the blank, you'll send a rapid and complex wave form down the blank and the sections may each find their natural frequencies. The tricky part is to judge exactly what happens at the joint, but it would be farily easy to measure if we had one. Let me know if you ever see the Ti blanks on clearance somewhere!

Bill, I've got some buddies with the older Daiwa TLs but I haven't fished them much so I wish I could relay more info about the power and actions. They seem to have an almost cult-like following. Do you have a Cabela's store near you? They carry the Daiwas and you might want to see them first hand. Check the handles since some of them a power hump with the double split seat. I think they're fairly comfortable and well balanced, but depending on how you hold your reel, some guys don't care for the hump.

I was looking at rods a couple of weeks ago and one rod that I was impressed with in that price range was the Shimano Crucial. The Fenwicks seem to be somewhat revamped...I think the AV has some new scrim technology and the Alconite concepts. The HMGs might not rank as high as the TLs, but either of those blanks deserves better guides I think.

mark

Mark,
I am not familiar with the Diawa and I do not think that there is a cabela's in the whole state. I do have some pieces of the titanium tubing though that I was given by Lamiglas and I could send you a couple of pieces along with some pieces of graphite that fit into it if you wanted to make some measurements.

Emory, That would be great. I've got some blems I could splice into as well and we could make some comparisons.

Bill, I didn't say anything about the Arrius since they aren't so popular here in the Midwest and I haven't seen or fished them. There is a very loyal following to them in the Southwest though. If you go over to tackletour.com you can read some reviews and see some comments about them on the forums. Warning.... I've never read a bad review on any rod there, but you will get some good detail on the performance features.

mark