Howdy all,

Im sure this subject has been broached a few times before but once again i would like to try and get some pro tips on ways to apply Rod Finish Epoxy and get that perfect finish.

There are many application methods, brushes, sticks, credit cards etc. and i find a stiff flat sable hair brush to be most effective. My biggest problem is getting the build to the perfect height in one application, .

Question - is it a standard for people to put more than one coat on? I use Normal Felx Coat Rod Finish Epoxy

Question - If a second coat is put on, how long should you wait before applying it over the first?

Question - What is the best method for getting a perfect finish where the epoxy stops at the end of the wraps (That clean cut line between the blank and epoxy) and has a nice proud build to it? Does anyone know how they do this in the factory when building rods? My problem with my finish seems to be the epoxy just tapers down and off the end of the wraps with no definition to its build.

One last question - Every now and then you get little wicks sticking up where the thread has been cut off to finish the wrap, how do you get rid of these without having to do a complete re wrap?

Look forward to any replies.

Cheers

Rob Hardaway

Rob,

If you will just do a search on this board, you will find more info than you will care to read on this subject. All of your questions have been answered many many times.

Gerald Mc

I think most people do use more than one coat, although I seldom do. You have to remember that each finish will only support so much of itself. So, some of the thinner finishes can't be put on heavy enough in one application to get the coverage or depth desired. With products like Flex Coat, Glass Coat, the Amtak Clear Coat and the Pac Bay finish, you may get by with just one coat. Although many still use do it in two. The high build version of LS Supreme is pretty thick and will support a good deal of itself. I think it's a true one coat finish for most applications.

You can recoat any time you wish, but unless you want to have to prepare the surface, you'd best apply additional applications within a couple days of each other. You can apply them just as soon as the previous application is no longer tacky.

If you will take a look in the online library here, you'll see a nice article by Rich Forhan on applying epoxy. You may find it helpful.

...................

Good finishing is an an art, a technique that must be aquired through practice. What works for one individual may not work for the next. But here is what I do....

I too use cheap coarse bristle brushes (aka acid brushes) that I throw away often.

Question - is it a standard for people to put more than one coat.........

Many do, it offers a little more control vs. one single coat. On the first application air is released. If this coat is too thick some of the air bubbles are captured. Best to do it via thin 1st coat, then followup with final coat some 24 hrs later.

Question - What is the best method for getting a perfect finish where the epoxy stops at the end of the wraps

Speed works best for me. Rotate quickly. It takes some pratice, but it works. Some time ago there was a post re using a piece of thread for forming straight edges. I have never tried it, but sounds like it would work.

SOME factory rods have straight finish edges, but the majority do not and look pretty sloppy. With thick coats of THIN finishes the finish tends to draw away from the edges and towards the center to form a blob and expose the thread as you describe. Do some test wraps and coat as usual then WAIT unitl the finish has setup some and retouch edges to see how thicker finish works on these edges that are bugging you. From your post sounds like you might be using too thick of a coat of thin finish to begin with.

One last question - Every now and then you get little wicks sticking ....

There is no trickery to this. You just have to ensure no fuzzies are sticking up before you apply finish. I use binocular magnifiers when I wrap to see things clearly. I usually pull all thread ends to the 180* axis all along the blank so that I don't have to be looking all over the blank for fuzzies caused by this step. I am also very careful when cutting tag ends - spreading the overlaying wraps apart slightly and using a fresh razor blade to cut the thread at a level below the surface of the thread wrap. Once all the wraps are done I visually go over everything quickly and with a torch flame all thread ends off. rarely do I get a fuzzy sticking up through the finish.

Lou....what are binnocular magnifiers? Could you possibly refer to an exact website and where to see them, or a page number in a Cabelas catalog? I THINK I know what you mean. But not familiar with the term binnocular magnifiers. Would appreciate your help.

Rod.....you might want to try all the techniques yourself, to find out what works best for you. Probably no single technique is going to be perfect the first time you do it yourself. So I wouldn't practice or do it on a real blank. Sooooo....perhaps a friend has a broken arrow you could do wraps on and finish them to practice your finishes. Even a piece of cheap dowel from Wal-Fart if you are only interested in the finish.....as opposed to say a two thread wrap and how it would look on a black rod.

Also if you can make some thing to rest your hand on when refinishing it makes it a little easyer and nicer. Better controll

The arm rest has helped a great deal for me to keep things neat , for strait edges I use Permagloss first and make an edge 1/16" or so past the thread when I coat the whole wrap . The second coat ( LS ) adhears to the strait edge of the PG and no farther , gives a nice clean edge . But , you are still talking of a two application finish process . Have fun , JHD

Got Fish ?

Rob,
Here's a trick I do when applying epoxy (finish) to the threads especially guide wraps. It was shown to me by a vetern rodbuilder down in Alabama so I'm not taking credit just passing it on. Mix the epoxy slowly for approximately 5-6 minutes then pour it into an aluminum pie tin. Use a heat source briefly to get rid of most (or all) of the bubbles before applying. Liberally apply the finish to the guide wraps to the point it literally is running off. This will only work with non-color preserver threads. Let the finish soak into the threads for about 10-15 minutes until it "floods" through the threads under the guide foot. You will see it fill the gap under the foot pushing all the air from the inside out (no bubbles). Once it floods, remove as much finish as possible basically just enough to lightly coat the threads. Let it turn (preferably overnight) then apply your second and usually the last coat of finish. By applying a good base coat the second goes on much smoother. I usually apply finish just to the thread edge on the first coat then overlap it onto the blank on the second. I push a wall of finish onto the blank which almost self guides and creates a very clean edge about 16" onto the blank. This is just how I do it but it makes a very secure bond between the guide foot and blank and allows all the guides to look very even and symetrical. I occasionally use LS Supreme but usually use Aftcote because it is a tad thinner and flows a bit better. Both are virtually bubble free but I seem to get better results with the Aftcote. You also get a longer pot life from the Aftcote but it takes much longer to cure.

[www.jannsnetcraft.com]
These are the binocular magnifiers that I use, Jim. They are really nice on these old eyes. I also have a magnifying lighted lens on a swing arm, but rarely ever use it now that I have these.

Putter
Williston, ND

The good edges on production rods are created by 200 rpm application speed and experienced guys doing the work. If you have a rod lathe chuck up a piece of blank and mix up some finish. Set the blank turning fast - estimate 200 rpm - load a epoxy application brush and quickly let the brush unload in a spiral form of the finish about an inch long on the blank - watch it for four or five seconds and you will see the finish start to flatten and distribute throughout the area. Now take the brush - lay it flat on the edge and use the thing like a flat spatula to start flattening out the area. Move the brush back and forth and you will observe a little ridge of finish that moves in front of the brush. To get the edges the pros just move the brush to a position that forces that little ring past the edge of the guide. You will also see why the commercial factories do not do locking or security wraps on single foot guides. The do rods in seconds and the extra time required for tedious work would not be acceptable.

If you want to do this all the time Roger Sieder will be glad to ship you one of his 200 rpm production type finishing machines with a stop clutch for the security wraps. Using this thing ain't no trick it is the real deal.

Long winded huh Gerald - all the board readers should watch Sharons' guys work!! I don't think this detail we saw has been posted.

Gon Fishn

Got it. Thanks putter. A friend had a pair and pointed those out at his fly tying desk a few months ago and said they were great. Only thing he will use now. There is a dandy little clip on magnifier that clips on your bench or desk with a flexible shaft. I will hunt up on the web and post the web site for you to see. Just as an FYI.

Thanks
later

I use my magnifier hood for everything, including tying size 26s, wrapping guides, finishing, etc. You could say that I'm addicted to them. Mine is 4 power, which I haven't seen for sale recently; usually it's 2.5x. Try your local jewelry supply house, since they cater to other craftspeople who make little decorative things (the opposite of fly rods).

Jim

Jim

Wow! 4x? That sounds good. I have a pair of 3.5x glasses from Wal Mart but don't like to use them. I was thinking a 2.5 was kinda low. 4x Sounds real good. ICW the mini flex magnifier I mentioned.....I actually haven't used it. But, I took it to a local non expert fly rod building class.....which I already dropped out of. But 3 out of the 5 there used it while I was doing other stuff.....point is they all wanted one and asked me to get to info for them. My wife just handed it to me one day saying she ordered it for me. Anywhoooo.....I found it on a web site for $21-26 bucks. I am not experienced with posting pictures....but I will look up the web site and post it for those who might have an interest. It only has about an 8" shaft and the clip holds it to a desk ledge well. I don't remember the power. It has a a 3" diameter lense....with a little nickle sized more powerful magnifier for closer looks. I am not that used to it.....but again......others fell in love with it. Sooooo if it is even possible to be helpful.....I gonna look it up. I am definitely going to get a hold of those 4x binnocular magnifier head mount things you have. Thanks for the help. There is a lot of stuff out there one can buy before he finally gets to a good thing sometimes. Word of mouth is the best recommendation I know of. oh....BTW.....I saw them pushing the architects maginifier lamp with the long adjustable arms and such.....out of the way and using this little magnifier!

The other Jim