As promised, I enclose a first picture of my first "serious" rod. It's a 30-60 lb 6'0'' jigging rod.

This is the one I wrapped with silver metallic underwrap nd blue metallic overwrap.

The question is that I wanted to test if a coat of CP would avoid metallic blue thread to darken after finish would be applied. After making underwrap, I aplied a coat of Amtac lite fonosh, then a made overwrap, applied a coat of Amtac CP and a first coat of Amtac lite finish.

As you can see in the picture I posted in fishingphotos.net (http://www.fishingphotos.net/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=5388&sort=1&cat=500&page=1) there is a "milky" area in the edges between blue and silver threads. This "milky" part has a slight blue hue, so I imagine the problem was with the CP.

Any comment will be welcome.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/08/2005 03:54AM by Daniel Rotea.

I didnt look at pic but I have had the same problem and I have learned it was due to the CP not drying totally. It has happened due to high humidity.

Thanks Dave

The light blue tint, might be from the color of teh thread not being colorfast or something, and when the CP is applied the dye from teh thread mixes with the CP (or epoxy). I haev seen this with a few threads, from different companies - this may not be what happeneed to you, but it might be. Don't know what to do about it either.

Image Pending approval at this time

If you read the article in RodMaker on color preservers, you may recall that you can put the acrylic CP's into "shock" if you thin them with cold tap water. The emulsifiers then seperate from the mix and you end up with cloudy areas. I don't know that this was your problem, but it's something to consider if you thinned the CP with tap water.

...........

I did look at the picture. And it looks like a beautiful rod you're doing there, Daniel Rotea. NIce job on the ring / accent band over the middle of the underwrap. That thread was either saturated with CP and never fully dried before the thread finish was applied; or that it just wasn't dry enough before the epoxy was applied. And the epoxy draws out the CP's acrylics and causes them to precipitate (turn milky, go "colloid"). ...

Dan, I have yet to use any of the metallic threads. But I had thought that I have read several times over the last 8 months that the metallic threads do NOT need to have ANY Color Preserver applied, because the outer metallic sheath will not absorb the CP anyway. Any micro-fractures in the surface of the metallic sheath just allows the CP to enter into and wet the core thread. Then the wet CP just stays there, like a damp sponge, trapped under the metallic sheath, where it cannot evaporate to dry or get much oxygen to cure. Then when another liquid comes along, like your thread finish (epoxy type or varnish, it doesn't matter), there is a mixing of the two liquids along the interface, driven by the concentration gradient (not convection = stirring). The acrylics in the CP are either re-dissolved and precipitate (milky), or if not fully dry, then they are wicked out into the new liquid (the thread finish), and then they precipitate or form a milky-looking colloid. Also, a heavy application of CP leaves a fair amount of CP trapped between the adjacent layers of the thread, where it may not be able to dry, and will be easily drawn off the outer metallic sheath when the new thread finish hits it. Again, the mess just turns milky. ... So, that's my explanation.

Can anyone verify that it is NOT necesssary to use CP on metallic threads?

Dan, you may want to SEARCH for Lou Reyna's comments on this subject (METALLIC) in case he or Billy Vivona are not reading this morning. Being careful of how you put tension on the thread is also a factor here. You have to use a reel drag / clutch plate type device, like the @#$%& Tensioner. If you pass it thru the pages of a book, you'll get lots cracks in the metallic sheath (is that your case?), or the clamping pressure from a book will just strip the metallic sheath off the core completely (not your case). ...

Unfortunately, I doubt there is a remedy the milky appearance of your current situation, short off slicing the threads and re-wrapping. The epoxy finish has been applied and emtombed the wet CP. If any micro-cracks ever develop in the epoxy, and water, especially salt-water, gets in there, the milkiness could get worse, especially around the guide foot's heel and toe. ... The only consolation may be that it won't seriously decrease the thread's wrap strength for a long time to come, and is really mostly just an eyesore. That rod will still whip fish to the deck, milky wraps or not.

Best Wishes, -Cliff Hall, Gainesville, FL-

Thank you to everybody for your comments. After reading your comments, it seems that CP was not dry enough. This problem could be even increased due to the fact that it could enter between metallic part and core. I didn't thin CP, so this was not the problem.

As Cliff says, metallic thread don't need CP. The problem is that I read in Dale P. Clemens book that he used it always, not juts to preserve color, but also to let trapped air to go out the wrap. He was probably talking about nylon vs NCP threads, not metallic ones.

After reading Cliff's reply, the only question I have is how to use CP over a nylon wrap with metallic bands.

Regarding cracks due to tensioning, I had this problem and I'll try to solve it with next rod.

This is the second rod I build, and just the first with underwrap, so I think it will stay "milky". I feel result will be worst if I try to "peel" wraps and build them again!!.

Thaks again to everybody!!

Yes the CP was not dry. I just looked at picture. What I would d next time you have wraps like that one, just use a hairdyer for a couple of minutes on it before you put finish on it, just to make sure the CP is dry. Thanks Dave