Please explain the differences between the various "cork" used for handles. The burnt cork illustrated in Clemens book does not appear to be the same as the burnt cork shown on Andy Dear's website. How is the burnt cork made? How does burnt cork differ from cork burl. How is cork "dyed". I am under the impression that it cannnot be effectively dyed.

Please chime in with any cork comments.

How do you know who has good/excellent cork. In other words there is no uniform grading system and prices seem to vary all over the place. I want to acquire some cork for my first attempt at turning my own grips. Usually, what happens is I search all over, buy something and then find something better than what I bought.

John Kepka

There will be a uniform cork grading system as of April. I think it will revolutionize the way cork is graded and sold and it will provide you with actual views of what each grade should look like.

Burnt cork is made through a chemical process (or so I'm told). What Andy has is just a shade darker and harder than what most of us remember as the original burnt cork. If you look really close, the composition is also a bit different. But the coloration comes from the process, I suspect.

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John. I know you can dye regular cork and Mudholes' "knotty cork" as I have done it with Miniwax stains. Stain provides a very nice finish over unfilled cork and I recommend the process highly. It has redeemed cork grips for me. It I am currently trying to determine the number of coats of Golden Pecan it takes to both stain and add a luster to a grip.

Tom, you mean some thing in this industry is going to be written in stone?? Wow

John,

In my experience, buying cork is pretty much a crap shoot! In my opinion, there isn't much good cork out there. I think that, for the most part, cork is graded differently by everyone who grades it. The last batch of regular cork that I bought was considerably less than 50% useable. Many builders use filler (as do the pre-made handles) These look nice until th filling falls out(and it will)
I have pretty much switched to all Burl. Burl is consistant and uniform in quality and very durable (it is sort of the "pressed wood" of the cork world. It is slightly heavier, but IMO, the difference is negligible. It comes in brown, blue, red, and green. The colors are subtle, not bright. The brown and the red are my favorites. I think that Burl is especially striking with a coat of Tru-Oil on it. I also use EVA and/or wood trim rings in some grips forr a nice contrast.

I can't speak for "Burnt cork as I have only heard about it(before my time), Andy's new stuff (2 types) really looks nice and from what I hear, it is very nice. Since it is man made, the quality should be very consistant (Just the fact that Andy is selling it, speaks for the quality. Andy "don't sell no junk".

I haven't heard of anyone successfully dyeing cork, although I understand a lot of builders are getting good results with stains. Bill Boettcher has a pretty unique way of making his own colored rings.

If you are going to order cork, I would call and personally talk to a vendor about the quality. They are generally very up front about it.

This probably doesn't help you much, but I tried!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2005 11:06AM by Mike Barkley.

I guess I should clarify that I meant "stain" rather than "dye". The stain is applied to a finished grip. Mike, you definitely need to try cherry stain over uncolored burl. Trust me on this one.

Mike is telling it like it is. We all know it's true. Everybody has their own name or code for their various grades or quality of cork. And to make matters worse, nobody has any photos or representative samples to show what any their own grades look like.

The answer, is to come at this from the opposite direction - a standard has to be set and samples or views of what each grade actually looks like has to be published. This is long overdue but it'll be ready around March or April. Dealers may still keep their current grade names (AAA, Flor, Super, whatever) but they'll have to put them against the industry standards for clarity and content. I'm betting that most everyone will adopt the new grading system for the simple purpose of having their customers know what to expect when they order cork. Those who don't want to use the standards, will remain in a "crap shoot" that I really don't think most customers like very much.

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I still have some of the original burnt cork. In looking at the pictures that andy put up from what I can tell from the pictures it appears to be very close to the original burnt cork. It appears to have larger pieces in it, more like cork burl, but it seems to have the same rich brown color or is at least is very close in color to the original.

I make up my own colored cork rings. Can't see why it can't be done with burnt cork also. Just " toast " large chunks of cork dust to the color you want, mix some clear, thin, then add the cork. Poor into a mold, and Wa La

I use Miniwax stains, the regular can, not the one with the extra urethane. Golden Pecan and cherry are my favorites. The cherry is very dark on cork. The Pecan just seals and adds a hint of color. Wipe off the excess with a coffee filter. The more coats, the greater the luster. Eats filler, which is okay as the grip looks better without it.

Dan,

I intend to try it! I have seen your (and other's posts about it) The pix on the photo page are very sharp!!

My post was so long that between the time I started typing it and the time I hit Post, there were four posts made (including yours) That's what I get for being long wided

Mike

AM i looking at the wrong page on Andy' site? I see wild exotic burl. Is this the burn cork?

John,
Do you see two pics on Andys page? If so its the dark stuff on the right hand picture.
Noel

Tom et al,

Tom wrote: But the coloration comes from the process, I suspect.

I was looking at the rings and thought the coloration came from a different color cork...say 10% brown cork added to another color.

But something is definatly burnt...maybe the whole ring?
Forgive me some cause I never used any of the old burnt cork.

I have been experimenting for the past few months with various Stains and have found the MinWax formulations to produce the desired color and finish I desired. I am using 4 main options: Golden Pecan, Colonial Maple, Cherry, and Natural. I have tried all of the light colored satins and will continue to use the 4 above mentioned options.
Other brands of stains seem to have too much Polyuranthane and dry to a slick finish on the handle requiring a buff or sanding phase.

I purchased the MinWax Fruitwood formulation and I just can't get an acceptable finish for the handle. The resulting color is too green for my liking.

I will be experimenting with the darker stain color options soon for a new "Big Boy Toy" Muskie rod that I have to build myself. I had built 2 for myself and a couple of my fishing buddies decided they liked them so much I couldn't afford to keep them any longer. I'm interested in the "Red" color tones as the handle will have 2 sets of wood inserts; Maple or Ash and Walnut.

All of the stains I use darken the cork to a degree depending on the number of applications.

Most of the "Pros" have been using Tung Oil for a long time. I will advise anyone considering to purchase Tung Oil, don't buy the cheap stuff, I did and realized the difference from one handle to the next. Needless to say, I have disposed of the cheap stuff. I might also mention the application method I've found most efficient is the use of the disposable foam brushes.

Finally a word of caution: Don't show off all the different stain creations to "Your Significant Other" if you don't intend on refinishing some furniture with your new found talents. We use to refinish alot of chairs, tables, desks, etc. and I've been getting the shuttle hints that this piece and that piece could use a "face lift".... Oh well it's a long winter up here in MN

I agree with Mike Barkley, burl cork is great stuff and I also use it now on all my rods.

For what its worth Burl cork can weigh as much a 4X a AAA ring.

The cork Andy has is 3X the weight...I use it sparingly.

Chris,
Have you actually weighedthem? I know it is a little heavier, but 4 X's?? I don't have a scale that can weigh grams but they don't feel that much heavier. Has anyone actually weighed them? I'd be curious!

I just don't find the weight in the butt that big a deal. Of course, I use a lot of split grips and small or no foregrips.

Mike

Mike,

One of the AAA rings I had weighed 1.8 grams.
The cork andy has weighed something like 6 grams.

I really would like my jigging rods to have shorter butt grips such as 3 1/2 or 4", but they just don't balance properly then. Maybe this would help out my troubles with this.
I actually made a rod like this a few years ago and just can't fish with it due to the balance problem. I was going to add a few inches into the butt and add cork over it to make it useable the easiest way I knew how. Now, maybe I'll try removing the cork and putting this in place and try that???

Putter