I've noticed that very few of the current bunch of bamboo rod makers bother with impregnating their cane and instead just varnish them. Kusse is the only one I know who is impregnating his cane. Yet this was a very popular practice among most commercial rod builders of the past. Is this because impregnating is so hard to do that it's only cost or time efficient in large production batches? Or are all these guys convinced that it interferes with rod action or makes the final rod too heavy? What modern resins are used for impregnating cane?

When cane is heat treated some internal changes take place. One of these is to drive out moisture and resins. The result is a lighter, crisper rod that is more responsive and more efficient. When you impregnate the rod with a resin you are putting back some of that weight, and performance will suffer to some degree.

For most, it is a matter of which is more important - the lighter and more responsive nature of the varnished rod, or the greater durability of the impregnated rod albeit at some slight loss of performance. (By durability I am not so much talking about resistance to breakage as I am the reduced maintainence and resistance to moisture.)

Not only that, but many craftsmen take great pride in their ability to produce a fine surface finish. And, those finishes are tougher than many might think.

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Tom--that's the answer I expected, however On Kusse's web site he goes into a very long description of the tests he conducted before he decided to impregnatae his rods. To keep it short he tested many different resins for both weight and effect on performance and came down to 1 that resulted in no negative effects on performance and also did not add any more weight than a good varnish job. So I guess my followup question is: is Kusse the only one who has bothered to do the tests and are all the rest just going on the myth of the added weight and decreased performance? Finally, is this negative effect on performance a reason that Orvis impregnated rods are said to be "Built to last but not to cast"? I guess I'm still not convinced either way--Larry

According to the book by Dick Spurr on Wes Jordan, We calimes that the upatke of the bakelite resin is 9% by weight. Accoridng to the Garrison book, the weight addition of varnish is 60 grains (0.137 oz.) Assuming you have a rod with 2 1/2 oz. of bamboo in it, impregnation adds 0.225 oz. or 0.088 oz. more than a varnished rod. That ain't a heck of a lot.

My observation is that the taper of the bamboo rod has way more to do with the action that the finish. Orvis rods have gotten a bad reputation because many of the common models prodcued in the 70s and 80s were rather stiff (because of their taper). However, there are many Orvis rods that are belie this trend. The Nymph (8'0" 4wt) is a very slow rod, too slow for many of my friends (I think it's great, except in wind). The Limestone Special (8'6" 6wt) is another galring exception, about the best in its size I';ve ever cast. The Midge is another (7'6" 4/5 wt) but I've never cast one. And the rods of the Patent Pending era (pre 1951) are just tremendous all around rods.

And I really think there's something to the impregnation besides longevity. It's very difficult to find even a 55 year old Orvis with a tip set.

--Rich

Larry;
Another part of the story is that most bamboo rods are made by part timers these days, who just don't have the resouces to do the experimenting that this takes. Rod Kusse did it because he makes rods full time, by machine, so he can crank out several hundred test sections and a couple dozen finished rods without it taking most of his life to do. T&T, Bob Taylor and several others also make impregnated rods, so it's not really just Kusse doing it. There is also the situation of having to build to the market, the market perception of bamboo rods is rods less than 8' and 5 wt or less and with a glass smooth varnish finish. When you get into the longer, heavier and impregnated rods, there are still enough old rods out there for less money that most modern makers can't really compete with the used market.
john

If I was still making bamboo rods, and wanted to make some that would last and last with very little maintainence required, I would impregnate them. I still feel I would be giving up a tad bit of performance over a varnished rod but it's the overall package I would be interested in.

An impregnated rod is going to be a bit tougher. Although, all else being equal, it will also be a tad bit heavier and thus not quite as efficient. I hope no one comes off sounding as if an impregnated rod can't cast well, or will be so heavy that no one would enjoy using it. That's not the case at all. But there is a difference.

It would not be fair to compare an impregnated rod with a varnished rod unless they are of the exact same taper and length. If you do however, you will almost certainly feel a bit of difference.

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Thanks guys. I assume that with modern chemistry the impreganation process now would be more of a long soak than the pressurized process required to drive bakelite into the cane in yesteryear. I guess it's too much to hope that Ron Kusse would be willing to tell the rest of the industry what he uses for impregnating<VBG>. Guess I'll just have to go out and test cast some rods at one of the conclaves however based on Tom's comments and what I know about the variable perfromance of different rods made with the same exact taper I doubt I'll be able to tell much of a difference.

Probably not, but maybe some if all else is equal. Impregnating does not create a bad rod anymore than varnishing creates a good one. But there are pros and cons to both.

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