Has anyone had issues mixing epoxy at low room temps like60 deg F? When I mix now I make sure epoxy bottles are warm and liquid flows easily. Then I get good results with smaller volumes.

The warmer your epoxy is the easier it is to measure, mix and apply. Likewise, the warmer your epoxy is, the less pot life you will have. Manufacturers recommend using it at room temperature, which is generally understood to be about 72F.

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This depends on how precisely one measures. With rod finish or a bonding epoxy that flows through syringes and self sealing caps, the amount can be very small. If it is spooning a thick paste with components that vary in density, the amount needs to be greater.

Interesting topic. I mainly build fly rods and freshwater lighter spinning rods which don't require the volume of epoxy needed for off shore saltwater rods. I have built many rods and like Mr. Miller, I have always mixed 0.5 - 0.8 ml of each component for coating guides. I always do 2 coats of epoxy on all my rods. I have only had one case where the first coat was slightly tacky after 24 hrs of curing. The reason for this was there was a small bit of gummy hardener in my syringe I did not see when I measured out hardener. A second coat fixed the problem. I understand by using larger portions of each component it minimizes the effect of any errors in measurement. One possible reason for my success with smaller portions may be that I am a retired biochemist and very experienced at measuring less than 1 ml portions.

I’m not suggesting to needlessly waste, but one milliliter equals slightly over three hundredths of an ounce of product. A small package of two, two ounce components will make 19 rods at 3ml per part mix volumes and one coat. That’s a lot of years of building for most hobbyists buying rod finish at this volume. It’s unlikely they would ever get to the end before a new generation of finish comes out or something else happens.

I’m also versed in precise laboratory and field measurements of volume. There are times I mix small quantities without issue, but most of the time I like to mix enough to apply easily from the foil cups. I also think it’s easier to mix larger volumes in the plastic cups without getting bubbles or having such a large percent being scraped from the walls and bottom. The 3ml per component suggestion predates the self-sealing caps that make accuracy easy when using quality syringes. Still, it’s a good practice that isn’t terribly wasteful.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/14/2024 03:48AM by Kendall Cikanek.

Kendall Cikanek Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I’m not suggesting to needlessly waste, but one
> milliliter equals slightly over three hundredths
> of an ounce of product. A small package of two,
> two ounce components will make 19 rods at 3ml per
> part mix volumes and one coat. That’s a lot of
> years of building for most hobbyists buying rod
> finish at this volume. It’s unlikely they would
> ever get to the end before a new generation of
> finish comes out or something else happens.
>
> I’m also versed in precise laboratory and field
> measurements of volume. There are times I mix
> small quantities without issue, but most of the
> time I like to mix enough to apply easily from the
> foil cups. I also think it’s easier to mix
> larger volumes in the plastic cups without getting
> bubbles or having such a large percent being
> scraped from the walls and bottom. The 3ml per
> component suggestion predates the self-sealing
> caps that make accuracy easy when using quality
> syringes. Still, it’s a good practice that
> isn’t terribly wasteful.


Good advice.

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I have only been building rods since January but I had heard the advice about never mixing less than 3 cc's but decided on mixing a smaller amouint because i was only doing a few guides. What a mistake! The epoxy never cured. I had to scrape it all off and mix 3 ccs.

As long as you are very disciplined in your measurements I’ve used 1/2cc of each part for years without issue. You must scrape you mixing vessel very carefully as as to get everything mixed properly

The issue isn't what any particular one of us is able to achieve with small amounts, but what is the best advice for newcomers, novices, etc., when they ask how much to use, measure and mix. This is why the manufacturers recommend no less than 3ccs of each part. It's what they've found works best for the average user. Almost anybody can get good results with that amount. Smaller amounts require greater precision.

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I can usually do two rods on a 3cc each mix...but work fast.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 09/15/2024 07:17PM by Chris Catignani.

I have enough dumb luck/operator error with thread finish. I mix 3ml of each. I’m just now getting perfect level decal areas, etc. I started out using Gen 4, good stuff. I then tried D2 a few times and struggled with wavy areas. I figured out why. Operator error. I do like it, just have to tweak a few things. Been using Gen 4 again. Gen4 bubble release seems to beat all the others (my experience).

Ditto on Norman's comment.

I also mix what I need.

But, to avoid issues, I also work quickly and normally work with a batch of epoxy for more than 5 minutes. i.e. more than that after mixing - the finish is beginning to set up a bit and make it less desirable for a perfect finishing job.

No real reason to take more time than that when mixing and applying finish.

Note:
I also apply finish with the rod turning at speeds of 20-70 rpm. 2-3 minutes of time to apply finish to all of the guides and butt wraps for the first coat. Then, another minute or two to go back over the guides and do a final leveling and checking before slowing the rod down for an over night drying cycle.

I also never take any finish out of the mixing cup to put on an aluminum foil or anything similar. No need, when you work quickly and still have the finish level very nicely.

Best wishes.

Jeremy makes a good point about learning how a particular finish works. I remember a guy a good 35 years ago who tried three different brands as he failed to get a cure across four rods. Two brands were likely even the same product in different packaging (Flex Coat, Cabela’s). Over the years I’ve read and heard the “bad batch” conclusion a few times. Once it was due to the dreaded fisheyes because it was mixed poorly on parchment paper. I’ve seen manufacturer responses where they explain that getting a “bad batch” is virtually impossible. Two-part finish is made in large volumes, thoroughly tested before being packaged, and tested again before distribution. Continually switching the variable least likely to be the source of error isn’t likely to produce a better result. Anyway, a few times with any of them (without a big time gap hindering memory) helps to teach their individual properties.

Take the resin-to-hardener ratio provided by the manufacturer and take the project's size into account when calculating the amount of epoxy to mix. Always prepare a little bit more than what's needed because inadequate mixing can result in weak bonding or insufficient coverage.

spelling bee answers

Kendall Cikanek Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Jeremy makes a good point about learning how a
> particular finish works. I remember a guy a good
> 35 years ago who tried three different brands as
> he failed to get a cure across four rods. Two
> brands were likely even the same product in
> different packaging (Flex Coat, Cabela’s). Over
> the years I’ve read and heard the “bad
> batch” conclusion a few times. Once it was due
> to the dreaded fisheyes because it was mixed
> poorly on parchment paper. I’ve seen
> manufacturer responses where they explain that
> getting a “bad batch” is virtually impossible.
> Two-part finish is made in large volumes,
> thoroughly tested before being packaged, and
> tested again before distribution. Continually
> switching the variable least likely to be the
> source of error isn’t likely to produce a better
> result. Anyway, a few times with any of them
> (without a big time gap hindering memory) helps to
> teach their individual properties.


My issues with D2.. I wasn’t wicking enough off, and i was getting to deep when wicking, creating waves. All this because I was using too much heat and taking too long. Basically.. I was messing with it too much. That was the main issue. Gen4 has been more user friendly for me and I rarely have to use heat when using Gen4. I like that D2 sets up/cures faster. Gen4 takes 2-3 days to fully harden. Not a big deal. I’m still going to use the D2 I have. Will probably use it on the guides. I’m going to start doing the guide wraps separate from the decal area and epoxy ramps so time won’t be an issue and I won’t be rushed. The one thing I’m still trying to improve on. Straight epoxy lines at the end of the guide wraps.