Im building a set of tuna Rods and I had the blanks painted white. My original plan was to do all white rods. White under wraps and overwraps on the guides. However Im nervous that even though ive never had my epoxy yellow it might, and im nervous about those "rust" deposits that form around the guide feet. So im curious what you guys think. Should go with some greys instead and if so how light do you think I can go to hide anything that comes up later. I have some creams and off whites I can work with but I feel like its the same thing. So Im wondering if I go with a super light grey you think I will run into the same issues? instead of doing all white I might just do white, grey and silver theme and do silver underwraps and then a light grey overwrap? thoughts?

Maybe rust free guides could solve your delimma.

I think you have a unique and beautiful idea there.

ive never found it be a guide that rusts. Its what ive been told a mineral deposit that builds up and forms that color. if I take one out that looks like rust the guide comes out clean and rust free everytime. so I think its something that just happens regardless of guide. Its just whether you use a color that it will show up on. its why I think 99% of production rods use black.

Jasper,
In a word, white on a rod stays white for a very short time.
If that is what you want - go for it.
Battleship gray is the perfect color if you don't want to worry about changes.
Simply put, it is difficult to ever see any dirt, stains or color changes with battleship gray.

But, since you ask the question, you already know the answer.

Best wishes.

The problem of epoxy yellowing is twofold. First on the wraps, and that can be somewhat handled by color choice as you are trying to do. The other aspect is at the ends of the wraps where the epoxy goes beyond the wraps and in the butt area where you might be covering decals and text that leave bare blank in spots covered by epoxy. Those areas will in time yellow.

To totally fix the problem one can use U40 Permagloss or similar polyurethane product to cover the wraps and other spots on the blank. However, it is very thin and would probably take at least three coats and even then would not have the look of epoxy. Thread texture would be evident. This is not a functional issue because Flexcoat is very tough, flexible, hard, and does not yellow. CP would be required to preserve normal thread color and I would recommend it over decals and text. Some text media might run if CP is not protecting it. If you choose this route, do some testing to make sure you understand how everything will work.

Regarding rusting guides. SS guides do in fact rust, some more than others. It is not just a color change or stain. Some of the steel is being changed to iron oxide, rust. To be absolutely certain that guides won't rust use titanium guides. Even witih titanium rods should be rinsed in fresh water after every use. Also consider that most keepers are made of an unspecified grade of SS and I've found that many rust pretty fast. I would use titanium for a keeper. REC titanium fly guides of the appropriate size work nicely, as does the larger REC keeper size, assuming it is appropriate for your use.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/06/2023 06:16AM by Michael Danek.

Jasper,
The nature-of-the-beast is that epoxy (actually the hardener) will yellow with time. Some yellow more quickly or severely than others, even when left in the original bottles and isolated from UV exposure. While darker colors of blank or thread may disguise the yellowing to an adequate extent, white wraps on a white blank will accentuate the yellowing. Before building my own rods, I had 2 saltwater rods custom wrapped for me on white Calstar blanks in the mid 1990s; yes, yellowing of the epoxy may be evident but not worth criticism. Remember, the coat of epoxy you see on a thread wrap is only ~ .040in thick versus .5in or more looking through the entire bottle!
The most clear, non-yellowing thread epoxy I have discovered is CTS Crystal Coat. While it is a very thin viscosity which self-levels extremely well without bubbles, it does have an extended cure time and numerous coats will be required if a thick “lens” is desired. Although I have no personal experience, recently many builders have praised the qualities of Gen4.?.? I am unaware of a urethane coating from Flex Coat as Michael suggested, but anything and everything Flex Coat produces is top-notch. Possibly, Michael was referring to Trondak U40 PermaGloss which is an outstanding product albeit having some nasty chemicals in its makeup and would require numerous coats to build any thickness.
I have never had a rust problem with Fuji guides; prior to or since they switched to their CC treatment. But simply because there is iron in the alloy, virtually all stainless steels (304, 316 or what have you) CAN rust / oxidize. Oxidation free (for all intents and purposes) = titanium.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

Had brain lock up, the product I meant to mention is U 40 PermaGloss.

is there anything you can add over the standard finish to also stop the yellowing? like what if I put U40 over top of the epoxy?

Permagloss over top of epoxy would not help. If you want to use something that will not yellow, Permagloss is the way to go, it does not yellow, but will require multiple coats to get the same depth as epoxy. All finish epoxies will yellow over time, some more than others. The least yellowing epoxy I have used is Crystal Coat by CTS, it’s only problem is it takes a very long time to cure.
Norm

A lot will depend on how the rods are stored as to, how fast will the epoxy yellow. Like said earlier, "it all will yellow". White rods stored on a boat or in a hot area are going to get yellow quicker. Out of the sun in a dark cool place is best. Thick coats of epoxy are more noticeable and yellow quicker. They do look good when new though. The only type of stains I have seen on rods I have made, are at guides that were stainless (Fuji and Snake Brand) that corroded at the feet / base of the guide. These were rods used in saltwater exclusively. For rods that are used in saltwater I only use Ti frames now and make it a point to fill epoxy around the feet with no depressions near the base metal at all, that would allow dirt, salt water or anything else to collect or by capillary action be absorbed into it next to the metal.