What guides and ring material do you like to use for mag bass blanks? I got a NFC mag bass HM blank that is going to be used for everything but the kitchen sink. Will Fuji alconite guides downplay the blanks potential too much? Their cost point is pretty low but SIC guides cost 3x as much and this will be a freshwater only rod. Thanks for the input!

Alconite should do fine. SIC guides can be brittle and break easier. Any online search for 'SIC' and 'brittle' and 'breaking' will pull up numerous examples.

Kent Griffith Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Alconite should do fine. SIC guides can be brittle
> and break easier. Any online search for 'SIC' and
> 'brittle' and 'breaking' will pull up numerous
> examples.

I have come across that but I've also read that may be over-reported and not as much as an issue anymore. Honestly, I'm not worried about them breaking.

I also was looking at the American tackle TiForged guides, but I've never used them before

Alps MXN with Zirconium if you want something nicer than Alconite - not as brittle as SiC

Alconite is a quality ceramic . If I was planning on targeting mostly long running hard fighting gamefish I might opt for SIC but Alconite is extremely popular and a huge seller for very good reason even on top end rods .

Weight between aconite and SIC is similar and better ring to frame mounting methods have made "spit" or broken rings almost a rarity. I doubt you're going to find much difference in terms of performance, and certainly not from a casting perspective. On large, hard running fish where line may spool out for many yards at a fast pace, SIC might be a consideration. For what you're doing you'll not likely see any difference.

...........

You really don't need Ti frames on all fresh water rods. Fuji Stainless frames with Alconite rings will work great. I would use an RV6 or KW10 followed by KB5s and KT5s on the tip section with 5 tip top. I believe any quality frame that is similar to these would also work. AT, Seaguide, Alps or Kigen.

Lance Schreckenbach Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You really don't need Ti frames on all fresh water
> rods. Fuji Stainless frames with Alconite rings
> will work great. I would use an RV6 or KW10
> followed by KB5s and KT5s on the tip section with
> 5 tip top. I believe any quality frame that is
> similar to these would also work. AT, Seaguide,
> Alps or Kigen.

Sounds good. I planned on going kw10, kw 5.5, then a few kb5s and a few more kt5s

You don’t NEED Titanium frames but they will make a noticeable difference in the feel of the rod. I have rods built exactly the same except for guidetrain and the difference substantial IMO. You could always order a set of each, placing them in the same positions and see firsthand what I am talking about . The unused set could then be utilized for another project or returned to seller for a refund.

I almost exclusively use Fuji KR guides. As Lance suggests KW10, KW5.5, and KB/KT 5 or 4.5 runners, with an LG tip top. Can’t go wrong with them.
Norm

Thomas Kaufmann Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You don’t NEED Titanium frames but they will
> make a noticeable difference in the feel of the
> rod.

Thanks for saying this. I have never used titanium frames because I never considered them worth the expense, but if what you say makes that much of a difference then I would consider using them on rods where sensitivity is a critical issue. This comment is a gem in the haystack! PayDirt on page 1~! I'll keep this nugget on the back burner until needed.

ADDED:

I gotta ask... I can see how a titanium frame versus steel can make a noticeable difference on say tall guides where the titanium can really make such a difference like on a spinning rod, but I use a lot of mico guides on all of my bass rods and the ring is so darn close to the blank as is, so I have to wonder if titanium versus steel makes that much of a difference with so little metal in between ring and rod?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2022 10:22AM by Kent Griffith.

If a spinning rod, I would go with the Microwave 25's. They come in Black, Chrome or TiON and with the Nanolite rings, they are braid-impervious! The guide train is also very light, especially the running guides, so the blank action is retained pretty well.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/18/2022 11:42AM by Richard Bowers.

Kent, I build 99.8% micro bass rods. Even in micros the difference is substantial IMO. A titanium framed vs stainless butt guide ( especially if you are using Kw’s, IMO kw’s are TANKS) will be almost 1/2 the weight! Many say the difference is negligible, however; many of those people have not weighed their guides to see the real world difference. If you are building on an HM blank allow it to be the most efficient that it can be by adding the least amount of weight to it.

There's certainly no problem with alconite rings,

Alconite is great and I have used it for years. SIC is also great, but overkill for my expectations/needs.

I remember when we all drooled over Carbaloy Guides! Ha! (Never saw one of them wear out, btw)

What are your values for a particular build? I try to weigh cost, confidence, conditions, and cosmetics.

I do get the "weight is not great" angle, too. I need to get my scales out and satisfy my curiosity!

I think most, if not all, modern ceramic and metal guides, are going to hold up just fine to most modern lines under freshwater large or smallmouth bass fishing conditions. I'm talking about the reputable manufacturers, not knock offs.

On a side note, I built a couple rods for a crappie fishing buddy and used the REC guides because he abuses his gear. He uses braid exclusively and has caught literally hundreds of fish with no visible signs of wear or grooving; tip top included. Granted, crappie don't put an inordinate amount of stress on a rig. However, hundreds/thousands of repetitions with braid count for something even with minimal tension.

Just weighed some Fuji KR casting guide sets. My scale is an old double pan scientific scale and will weigh to 0.1gm. Not the most accuse scale but certainly good enough for comparison purposes.

1) The SS set contained BC Alconite guides with one KW10, one KW5.5 two KB4.5 and five KT4.5 the total weight was about 1.8 gm.

2) A Titanium2 Sic set contained the same styles, sizes and number of guides as the SS set and total weight was about 1.1 gm.

3) A second T2 Sic set substituted a RV6 in place of the KW10, and the total weight was about 0.7 gm.

4) The SS KB/KT 4.5 guides weighed about 0.6 gm, and the T2 KB/KT 4.5 guides weighed about 0.35 gm.

All three guide sets are sufficiently light, and give great performance. However, the titanium guides are about 40% lighter than the SS guides. It is also clear that the Sic T2RV6 is much lighter than the Sic T2 KW10. Hope this is of some help.
Norm

Norm, that's a great post. Thank you for the info. I personally already ordered an alconite set but you've really made me second guess that, so thanks for that. Haha

The Alconite SS guides will work very well. For me it’s very difficult to tell a real functional or performance difference between the SS and titanium guide sets. However, the titanium guides are really nice, but not sure if 3.5 X the price of SS guides (about $20) for titanium guides (about $70) is worth it.
Norm

Thomas Kaufmann Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kent, I build 99.8% micro bass rods. Even in
> micros the difference is substantial IMO. A
> titanium framed vs stainless butt guide (
> especially if you are using Kw’s, IMO kw’s are
> TANKS) will be almost 1/2 the weight! Many say the
> difference is negligible, however; many of those
> people have not weighed their guides to see the
> real world difference. If you are building on an
> HM blank allow it to be the most efficient that it
> can be by adding the least amount of weight to it.

Thomas,
I use Ti framed guides because I mostly build in shore or bay rods for saltwater. I honestly can not tell a difference from SS frames to Ti ones, other than the fact that Ti does not corrode in saltwater environments. I have weighed them on a jewelry scale and the weights are identical on the small 5mm and 4mm guides. Sometimes the Ti framed ones weigh even more, I believe it is due to inconsistencies in the frame stamping. Also Alconite rings are lighter than SIC or Torzite.
Tight Lines