I’m looking for a fiberglass blank to backtroll plugs / kwikfish for steelhead and small salmon 10-20 lbs in rivers. 7’6” - 8’ long, one piece. No casting needed, just sitting in a rod holder with river current working the rod. Fast / magnum-type taper, something with a super soft tip that locks in the middle to a strong butt.

Most all salmon-specific blanks sold (marketed) for this purpose are graphite. I want mostly fiberglass, would be ok a little graphite to stiffen the butt (as Lamiglas does with their composite Kwik salmon rods). The most important quality in the blank is a soft tip that freely bends and wobbles.

Might some blanks designed (marketed) for bass or live bait or other uses also be suitable for this? The tip has to be really soft. I’m not very familiar with the different bass and live-bait saltwater blanks at all, to know if certain ones might double as river-plug rods for salmon. Am I completely off base with these possible substitutions?? General pointers or specific blank suggestions appreciated.

I have a Seeker S Glass BS806 blank. Would work well. Or you could look for a Lamiglas xcc plug blank.

The Seeker mentioned is good. Rodgeeks once made some similar models but the actual model number escapes me at the moment. Any true live-bait blank will work pretty well, too

The best models I've found for this sort of thing are the composite blanks that are glass with an outer wrap with a layer of carbon, save for the upper 1/3rd to 1/4 area nearest the tip. This provides the soft tip you're looking for but good power down the rod without ending up with a rod butt that's an inch in diameter.

..............

Another option I thought of late last night was the Thrasher blanks, they make a lot of composite blanks, including fly blanks. BSC7804, or 05 maybe. Don't know much about them as they only advertise their bluewater rods.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/29/2021 12:37PM by Spencer Phipps.

Steve,
Within his article on “Live Bait Rods”, Tom Kirkman expressed praise of the Seeker CLB series for their very lively, soft tips yet strong backbone. This is accomplished by using an E-glass blank which incorporates a few layers of CF in the lower 1/2 - ? . At the time Tom wrote the article, apparently the CLB series was out of production. However, Seeker presently offers the CLB series; whether the same as the “old” CLB is uncertain. Due to Tom’s praise, I purchased a CLB about 7 months ago to build a live bait rod for yellowtail and it has proved to be pleasurably perfect for the job, particularly the tip = very pleased.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

Steve,
What area are you fishing?

Some food for thought in replies above. I’d be better equipped to interpret them if someone could compare the usual tip-stiffness of equal powered (e.g. 10-25 lb) blanks in typical live bait vs. hotshot/plug/kwik designs. I’ve never compared them side by side.

Derick, I’m in Oregon. I fish the mid-coast (fall, winter) and mid/upper Willamette tribs (spring). Smaller water, no divers or dropper weights. I want a light salmon rod (Mag-M or Std-MH), as there are few real brute salmon left anymore.

Hot Shot blanks have light, fast, stiff tips. Live bait blanks have light, fast, soft tips. That's about the best way I can describe the two.

..........

Steve,
The CLBs fit your stated requirements perfectly; “I want mostly fiberglass, would be ok a little graphite to stiffen the butt (as Lamiglas does with their composite Kwik salmon rods). The most important quality in the blank is a soft tip that freely bends and wobbles”.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

I'm in Oregon as well. The Seeker blank would work, but I feel like you would be undergunned for moderate sized Coastal Chinook. It has a ton of backbone. But you are fishing smaller water. The XCC 93 3 has a ton of balls and will whoop a big fish....Maybe a 2 power would be a better choice.

Okay Steve, to best answer I feel like I have to know why you don't want a graphite hot shot blank. They seem tailor made for what you want to do. Ultra soft tip with ultra fast lock up to a strong butt.

If you insist on mostly/some glass you are pretty much pigeon holing yourself into live bait or crank bait blanks.

I fish a lot of live bait blanks so I am fond of them. But they are built for a different purpose. Their soft tip is for lob casting live baits without tearing them off the hook. The tips don't have near the sensitivity and wobble of a hot shot blank and they don't lock up as fast. They tend to be built with bigger fish in mind, weigh a good bit more, and have fat butts. They are blue water, offshore pelagic blanks. Sure they will do but at a substantial weight penalty and probably won't be nearly as good at imparting the correct plug action and letting you see when you picked up a little grass on your lure.

I can't comment on the glass/composite bass crank bait rods.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

Russell Brunt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Okay Steve, to best answer I feel like I have to
> know why you don't want a graphite hot shot blank.
> They seem tailor made for what you want to do.
> Ultra soft tip with ultra fast lock up to a strong
> butt.
>

The short answer is that fiberglass rods allow plugs to work better than graphite rods. I currently have graphites and prefer how my buddy’s glass rods fish. Simple as that.

The long answer is along the lines of what Tom wrote:
“Hot Shot blanks have light, fast, stiff tips. Live bait blanks have light, fast, soft tips.”

I would modify that by saying that graphite rods, even if designed with hotshot tapers to have a flexible tip, will still exhibit a faster tip recovery rate (and overall blank recovery rate) than glass. The faster recovery of graphite means less rod wobble, which tightens up (limits) the action of plugs in the water. In contrast, the slower recovery rate of glass allows plugs to work more erratically and cover a wider swath of water, bobbing and weaving. You an see it when fishing different rods side-by-side. Other usual benefits of graphite are less important, too. Plug rods often sit in a rod holder all day, so blank weight and diameter and casting efficiency are non-issues on the fishing side.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/30/2021 10:25AM by Steve Perakis.

Steve,

I appreciated reading your description very much. Take a look at the NEO by NFC, or any of the HYB (hybrid blanks) that go up to 7'11 in length.

Here are the links:

[northforkcomposites.com]

(I personally run k16s and divers on this blank, and use the lighter 704 for mag lips)

The tip is made out of zentron (a high mod glass) and the body is re-inforced with carbon. It is primarily sold as a bass blank for crankbaits/lipless cranks for that same purpose that you artfully describe.

Aleks

Steve Perakis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I’m looking for a fiberglass blank to backtroll
> plugs / kwikfish for steelhead and small salmon
> 10-20 lbs in rivers. 7’6” - 8’ long, one
> piece. No casting needed, just sitting in a rod
> holder with river current working the rod. Fast /
> magnum-type taper, something with a super soft tip
> that locks in the middle to a strong butt.
>
> Most all salmon-specific blanks sold (marketed)
> for this purpose are graphite. I want mostly
> fiberglass, would be ok a little graphite to
> stiffen the butt (as Lamiglas does with their
> composite Kwik salmon rods). The most important
> quality in the blank is a soft tip that freely
> bends and wobbles.
>
> Might some blanks designed (marketed) for bass or
> live bait or other uses also be suitable for this?
> The tip has to be really soft. I’m not very
> familiar with the different bass and live-bait
> saltwater blanks at all, to know if certain ones
> might double as river-plug rods for salmon. Am I
> completely off base with these possible
> substitutions?? General pointers or specific
> blank suggestions appreciated.

Derick Jahnke Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm in Oregon as well. The Seeker blank would
> work, but I feel like you would be undergunned for
> moderate sized Coastal Chinook. It has a ton of
> backbone. But you are fishing smaller water. The
> XCC 93 3 has a ton of balls and will whoop a big
> fish....Maybe a 2 power would be a better choice.

I’m confused when you say the Seeker has a ton of backbone, but I’d be undergunned? I am almost certain the XCC 803 blank is too much for what I want, it has been a while since I’ve held one, but I am thinking a 2 power is more suited. I also fly fish for chinook and am used to “light” tackle because of it. Most of the fall fish that I keep come from the ocean or bays, and my river fishing is more recreational, often in lower flows when it is best for the fly. This is also why a softer fiberglass rod has appeal.

I def contradicted myself. If you live in the Portland area, I have the 2 power XCC blank, 3 power button rod and the Seeker blank you can tug on to if that would fit the bill.

Derick, thank you. I have no plans to head to Portland anytime soon, but will keep it in mind if I do.

For anyone who cares, and doesn’t know what the fuss is about, I did happen to find a random youtube video showing a fiberglass rod working a plug. The wobbles in the blank, which sap energy from normal casting, add spastic movement to the plug. This is in pretty fast current and the rod (Lami Classic Glass 8’2” 8-20 lb) is just slightly underpowered in the butt for the fish I’m chasing. The 8’6” version of this rod series has a slightly different taper with a stronger tip, and creates even more wobble in the middle of the rod when fishing, but doesn’t lock-up as well to set the hook when a fish takes.

[youtu.be]

Steve,
I figured out what I was trying to say about the Seeker. The tip/top 3rd is soft, it transitions a bit until half way, then locks up fairly solidly. The XCC both powers are way more moderate.

NFC has the composite Delta blanks, the HS 821-1 just might be your huckleberry, love my GL3 G Loomis version I built 30 years ago. Lots of salmon/steelhead forum info on the HSR 821 I bet, i don't remember specifics, what I've run, but mag wiggle warts and K13 & 14 Flatfish have been my longtime favorite plugs for this rod, with or without weight. The big K15 & 16 get heavier rods like my Rogue HS868-2 I built for the Kenai when there were more and bigger fish there.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 12/01/2021 02:57AM by Spencer Phipps.

I wanted to add a couple of points to this discussion.
1. Most of the composite (glass tip/graphite butt) live bait stuff will be too heavy for most plug applications, the exception being the very lightest blank powers for the largest plugs like K16's etc.
2. In my experience, you're not really looking for an "erratic wobble" from the tip of a plug rod, but rather "the magic thump" that telegraphs across the entire upper third to half of the rod (the tip action IS a critical element of this.) Achieving this requires considering multiple factors including terminal setup, water speed, type of plug, and so on. It's my opinion that a glass blank will get you closer to "the magic thump" over a larger range of baits, but a given graphite blank will often be "the one" for a particular bait and set of river conditions. It's also my opinion that if you have an erratic track to a particular plug, it needs to be tuned, and if it can't be tuned (some are just stubborn) it needs to be tossed outright.. I personally carry 2 or 3 glass and 2 or 3 graphite plug setups in my boat. All that said, the Rainshadow GCB710M makes an AWESOME glass plug rod.

-Geoff @Batson

And I was wondering if the RCLB80XL was enough rod. It has the light tip and would twerk on down near the middle of the blank like the video. Yet it has enough butt to handle surprisingly big fish.

Steve, nice explanation on why you want what you want. Still think a heavier power lower modulus hot shot blank would be best but I totally respect where you are coming from. Not like I know squat about your waters.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.