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guide choices
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.inf6.spectrum.com)
Date: October 11, 2021 08:03PM

What variables in rod use should be considered to make the best choice of guides for a particular rod?

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Robert Flowers (---.res6.spectrum.com)
Date: October 11, 2021 08:30PM

Quality of build, what the rod will be used for, weight of the rod, sensitivity desired, type of line used, reel type, required power, guide spacing.. That's what I? can think of off the top of my head.

Tight Lies and frisky fish

RJF

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: October 11, 2021 08:58PM

Most guides are terribly overbuilt for the job they are intended to perform. Blanks will fail long before the guides will.

So, what are the lightest guides that can be employed to perform the required task, and for many seasons?

..........

Re: guide choices
Posted by: chris c nash (70.40.84.---)
Date: October 11, 2021 10:43PM

Phil loves to ask questions he already knows the answers to .

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Kendall Cikanek (---)
Date: October 11, 2021 11:10PM

1. Relative cost, weight, and sensitivity of the blank? I’m not going to put budget guides on the SCV blank I just ordered.
2. Personal preferences of the builder and/or customer? This puts the “custom” in custom rods.
3. Is this a rod that a TSA inspector will handle? I use the “taco” method to make inspections and repackaging easy, and still frequently have issues. Inspectors and inexperienced fishing partners tend to treat rods very roughly. I don’t use SIC rings for this reason.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Robert Flowers (---.res6.spectrum.com)
Date: October 11, 2021 11:22PM

I had a tip top on a rid that was supposed to be convertible as either a spinning, or fly rod. Using Spyderwire braid, The tip top insert developed a groove and caught the line so much that I had to replce the tip top. It was a name brand rod. There are guides that just don't hold up.

Tight Lies and frisky fish

RJF

Re: guide choices
Posted by: ben belote (---.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
Date: October 12, 2021 08:34AM

dang those diatoms..lol.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.inf6.spectrum.com)
Date: October 12, 2021 11:01AM

I guess what I was trying to discover is whether or not some brands/models of guides or guides made of certain materials are better suited than others for specific methods of fishing, such as trolling, casting, jigging, worming, live bait, etc. I do wish I were as knowledgeable as Mr. Nash gives me credit for!

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Michael Danek (---.alma.mi.frontiernet.net)
Date: October 12, 2021 11:26AM

Phil, most of us have our favorites, ones we trust based on our experience. It would help if we knew more about your application. One variable not yet mentioned is fresh vs. salt water. For salt I only use titanium, but other materials will work if given proper care. I think you have experience in salt with fly, right? I personally use Fujis, the KLH series on spin, the RV for the stripper on bait cast, and KB and KT runners on both. I do this because I've not had any failures, they look good, need little to no prep, and they come in a variety of frame materials and ring materials at different cost points and I choose based on my intent for the rod.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Kendall Cikanek (---)
Date: October 12, 2021 11:22PM

ben belote Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> dang those diatoms..lol.

They do make a great abrasive paste in braided line????. It’s guide a good thing both components aren’t readily available within the walls of most prisons. Steel bars wouldn’t take long to cut. However, any of the moderate to better ceramic rod guides are far harder than the silicate/silicon dioxide components of diatoms (and those steel bars). Aluminum oxide rings are fairly affordable and much harder than diatoms. Some real corners had to have been cut by that name brand maker, The Vickers scale doesn’t lie.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---)
Date: October 13, 2021 09:44AM

Michael: These days my fishing is chiefly done in salt water. I would like to buy "salt water safe" guides to build a "medium duty" (30#) salt-water surf rod. Do any guide makers clearly state the breaking or deformation strength of their guides? Do any guide makers promise or even qualify the salt-water resistance of their guides? If so, I would like to find and read this information for myself.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Spencer Phipps (---)
Date: October 13, 2021 10:21AM

Alps has data on their saltwater spray tests for corrosion, seen it many times, call Batson. I've done simple tests on different guides where I hang a downrigger weight of the guide and let it hang for a couple days, none have deflected let alone bent, or failed. Not very scientific, but neither is a hooked fish. If you check out the GSB surf rod demolition test on the Lamiglas YouTube channel, you'll see the tip top either pulls off, or fails in the 60 lb range, but remember the line is attached to the tip top, not running through it, but it gives you an idea of what it takes to blow one up.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/13/2021 10:45AM by Spencer Phipps.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: ben belote (---.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
Date: October 13, 2021 12:06PM

Kendall, when i first learned about diatoms, i went "oh no' i,m using braid that can,t be good..so i checked my rod tip tops for wear and found nothing..i use mostly alconites which are about 1800 on the vickers scale and diatoms are 1200..i think as long as i stay with ceramic guides i,m ok with braiid..i don,t want to use anything less than ceramics especially for tip guides..i don,t even use wire guides on my fly rods, all ceramic..

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Michael Danek (---.alma.mi.frontiernet.net)
Date: October 13, 2021 03:55PM

Phil, if you want bullet proof corrosion resistance get titanium alloy frames. Not titanium coated, solid alloy. I believe all brands will perform just fine for corrosion. But if you are experienced in salt you know that tackle should be washed with fresh water immediately after every trip. You need to ensure the reel, seats, and other components are not damaged by salt. My experience with hook keepers is that some are inferior to others for corrosion resistance. For that reason I would use titanium keepers for salt, or use a small titanium framed single foot fly guide for a keeper.

Not all titanium guides that I've used have shown the same bending strength/characteristics. You will not find any strength info from the makers. If you want to email me I will give you my impressions. But I tell you up front I have not done any formal strength tests.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: chris c nash (70.40.84.---)
Date: October 14, 2021 03:29PM

"I would like to buy "salt water safe" guides to build a "medium duty" (30#) salt-water surf rod"


Obviously you're talking about corrosion and what Michael said above about rinsing off your rod and guides after fishing in the salt is all that's required to make sure guide frames don't corrode on you . If you want more protection against corrosion, Fuji's corrosion resistant coatings are a good choice . If you want the ultimate protection against the elements full titanium alloy frames are the way to go and an even bigger plus for the titanium frames is their incredible weightlessness . Their lack of weight is the # 1 reason I prefer them, the fact that they resist corrosion the best is a very distant second to me but that may be your # 1 reason to choose them.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Michael Danek (---.alma.mi.frontiernet.net)
Date: October 14, 2021 04:53PM

Everything has weight.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: David Baylor (---.res6.spectrum.com)
Date: October 15, 2021 04:48PM

The veil comes off in the 11th post. I would have thought it would have been much sooner than that.

Phil, you're slipping.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Terry Kirk (---)
Date: October 15, 2021 05:18PM

David Baylor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The veil comes off in the 11th post. I would have
> thought it would have been much sooner than that.
>
> Phil, you're slipping.


I was waiting for the traditional what does it matter you can't push a rope through any guide.

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---)
Date: October 15, 2021 06:22PM

I have invented a new long-cast setup: I tie a 4' piece of strong rubber band between my running line and my leader. When the rubber band is out of the guide train I really haul on the forward cast, stretching the rubber band. When I release the line for the cast the energy stored in the rubber band should really launch the cast and that, added to the big push on the line created by the power of the rod unbending, should produce l-o-o-o-n-g casts!

Re: guide choices
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---)
Date: October 15, 2021 06:23PM

I have invented a new long-cast setup: I tie a 4' piece of strong rubber band between my running line and my leader. When the rubber band is out of the guide train I really haul on the forward cast, stretching the rubber band. When I release the line for the cast the energy stored in the rubber band should really launch the cast and that, added to the big push on the line created by the power of the rod unbending, should produce l-o-o-o-n-g casts!

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