Snake guides are wrapped from both ends so if or when they pull out, it's more a matter of the guide crushing inward due to the softness of the wire the guide is made from. A single foot guide, with a Forhan wrap, is far more secure than any snake guide will ever be.

............

I have used the Forhan wrap on singles foot guides, especially larger guides, and have had zero issues. I also have use single foot with normal wraps and yet to have one pull out, which I suspect could happen if a knot or loop got caught while fighting a fish or if you snag a guide on a branch while walking in the woods. For my future rods I will go with the added insurance of the Forhan, as it does not make for too much extra work. I always ensure I get a little dab of epoxy in front of any foot be it single or snake, just to add strength and keep water from penetrating the gap/tunnel between guide and wraps.

Since I hand wrap I am able to use Forhan wraps on both legs of a snake guide, making it just as or more sturdy than a single foot guide, and a snake guide is Much More Likely to deflect and shrug off a collision with an object than a single-foot guide. Snake guides are lighter and have a larger effective opening than one-foot guides with the same diameter opening.

why is it such a big issue when the line slaps the blank of spin rod or just touches the blank of a casting rod but it,s ok for fly rods..there is no effort in building flyrods to keep the line off the blank and it,s such a thick heavy line and such a long rod so you know there is a lot more friction to reduce casting diatance..i think this makes a very good case for using ceramic guides..there would be a less rod contact and greater casting distance..and you could make a proper forhan locking wrap..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/29/2021 10:03AM by ben belote.

Ben, in fly casting the line is almost always already outside the guides, so there is NO line slap. In the cases where one is shooting line, it is pulled through the guides that are under the rod, so very little if any line slap.

Hi Phil..i,m only going by my experience..all my fly rods have ceramic ringed guides and cast aand shoot line so much farther than my fly rods with snake guides..i don,t build rods over eighht feet to keep the swing weight down because these are bass bugging rods and i use fewer ceramic guides but can cast as far as a longer rod with wire guides..the line shoots so much better..give it a try..once you use ceramic you won,t go back to wire..lol.

Ben, I build only fly rods and have for about 40 years, and have used every type of guide available. I also teach fly casting and have found very little benefit with ceramics. Especially justifying their cost and fragility.

If you don't double-haul fly cast it's unlikely you will see any difference in casting performance between snake guides and one-foot guides: a couple inches maybe. For a fact snake guides will allow twists and wind knots in fly line to pass through more easily than "O" ring guides, and snake guides result in a fly rod with a lesser swing weight.

Mark, I am interested to see how you are securing the guides too. I use my own version of the Forham wrap, I do 4 "locking" wraps. 2 each way then a couple jam wraps. I have used this on all my builds using single foot micro guides, and I have repaired plenty of rods with micro guides too. Watching the video Roger posted, I am wrapping way too tight.

Steve

Steve,
Don't take the tension in the video represent how I wrap. I wrap tight enough, so that I can just barely rotate the guide using both thumbs on a guide.

If I can move the guide with one thumb, I will cut it off and wrap the guide more tightly.

Take care

Roger, you use a great amount of guide wrap tension, to me that is..i was wondering why so much..does not the number of wraps add up to more than enough tension even with a moderate amount of winding tension..or does the epoxy application loosen the wrap to some degree..Thanks

I used the Forhan locking wrap on a couple of the first flipping and pitching rods I built. I used Fuji L guides for the running guides on those rod. I've now started using Fuji K series guides, KBs and KTs as my running guides, and I don't use the locking wrap anymore. Not because I think it's overkill, or that it doesn't work, but because I don't like how it goes on the K series guides. It's a personal taste kind of thing.

I'm very careful when putting in or pulling my rods out of the rod tubes in my rod locker. I've never had a guide show any sign of pulling out, or even coming loose. I personally don't think it's needed, but I can understand why others prefer to use it.

hi David, i think locking wraps are a must on flipping rods because they take a beating when trying to get free of snags..sometimes even the rod gets snagged when trying to poke a lure free..lol.

Steve,how do you do four locking wraps especially two each way..do they wrap the leg..Thanks.

Ben, in the past I've broken a couple of rod tips trying to free hung up lures. I don't go to those type of extremes anymore. Especially since I've started building my own rods. I've give it an honest try when trying to get a bait back, but if it comes down to it, I'll break a bait off rather than risk a broken rod tip.

The problem with that comes if I happen to be using braided line at the time. Breaking 65# braid is not an easy thing to do. lol

yes, i know what your saying..i have come close to breaking a rod but sc2s are very tough..lol.. what,s silly is that i pour my own flipping jigs and worms..i think i,m cheap as Mark Talmo..i hate loosing lures..lol..but i love flipping, i have caoght severl bass over eight pounds while flipping. that,s a good bass in delaware..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/2021 07:55PM by ben belote.

Ben,
Are you sure? I mean I have been very thrifty, but can anybody REALLY be as cheap as Mark Talmo??

Ha! good point Gary..i can,t really be sure..i don,t have the first dollar i ever earned but i would not be surprised if Mark did..lol.

Ben,
Is that dollar I made back in the 1960s worth any more today?

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

good point Mark unless you have a great investment advisor..lol.