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Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Joel Babin (98.39.46.---)
Date: July 11, 2021 08:20PM

First time for everything... Coated a rod yesterday morning and just pulled it down only to find it's still tacky long after it should be. This was my finish coat. What are my next steps? Just re-coat?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2021 08:21PM by Joel Babin.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: July 11, 2021 08:58PM

Give it another day. If no better, apply another coat, thin as possible. Pay strict attention to your measuring and mixing. See here from last week: [www.rodbuilding.org]

..................

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Joel Babin (98.39.46.---)
Date: July 12, 2021 08:14AM

Thanks Tom. I'm not sure how I messed up the measurement. Momentarily distracted I guess.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: John Cates (---.austin.res.rr.com)
Date: July 12, 2021 12:37PM

Sorry you are having trouble.

A tacky finish is indicative of improper or insufficient mixing. This sounds like your finish is under mixed. Basically, mix it longer and more thoroughly. Scrape the walls of the cup and bottom but avoid introducing bubbles. The finish will appear marbled, then cloudy, then marbled again, and then clear, mix it until it is crystal clear.

There is a big difference between finish mixed 99% and finish mixed 100%. Always mix up equal portions and never measure less than 3 cc's of each part.

Once properly mixed you can pour it out on a paper plate covered in aluminum foil. This will extend the pot life and help get rid of bubbles.

Click the link below to watch our short video on mixing Flex Coat

[flexcoat.com]

As far as your rod, if you can scratch the finish off with your thumb nail then you will have to take off the finish and wraps and start over. If it doesn't scratch off, then put on another coat that is properly mixed. It will last 20 years instead of 100 years.

I hope this helps, let me know. You can always give us a call. 512-858-7742

Flex Coat Company
Professional Rod Building Supplies
www.flexcoat.com

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: July 12, 2021 12:55PM

Also,
Depending on where you live, it might make sense to put the outside in the sun shine. In particular if the outside temperature is 90 plus, the heat and bright sun shine will really help to cure the rod. So, take your dryer, set it up in a nice hot sunny spot and let it turn in the sun for a few days. Then, check to see how the finish has setup. The combination of bright sun and high temperatures will really to more quickly cure the finish on the rod than indoors.

Best wishes.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: David Janes (---.hsd1.fl.comcast.net)
Date: July 12, 2021 01:23PM

I had the same thing happened to me. I built an oven out of two long cardboard boxes and put a lite I. Side it and let it bake for two days. It worked. I’d start with just putting it I. The sun for a few days like suggested above.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Lance Schreckenbach (---.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
Date: July 12, 2021 04:21PM

Like John said; it probably wasn't mixed long enough. Don't worry about the bubbles, they will pop with a little heat after you apply epoxy. I usually warm my epoxy up before mixing. I would just re-coat with a thin coat.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Michael Danek (---.alma.mi.frontiernet.net)
Date: July 12, 2021 05:29PM

Old bubbles will not pop with a little heat. Simply applying another coat might work. But if the bubbles are closed, then simply applying another coat will not hide them. Lightly sanding them to open them up and take off the edges might provide a clean surface on which to apply another coat.

There is no 100% certain fix for this; it's about what would be most likely to succeed. I think a light sand, keeping out of the thread, is the most likely to succeed.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Mark Talmo (---)
Date: July 13, 2021 01:09AM

Joel,
All may not be lost! A post cure of 150*F may just prove enough to “cover your boo-boo”. It may take as little as 12 hours but plan on 48 hours, maybe even 3 days. David’s suggestion of a cardboard box with a light bulb inside is a quick and easy way to find out. But monitor the temperature so as to not exceed 160*F, even if with only with a cheepie meat thermometer. Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Michael Sutheimer (---.wi.res.rr.com)
Date: July 13, 2021 05:34AM

This time of year a parked car is the only drying oven you need.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Joel Babin (98.39.46.---)
Date: July 13, 2021 09:09AM

John Cates Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry you are having trouble.
>
> A tacky finish is indicative of improper or
> insufficient mixing. This sounds like your finish
> is under mixed. Basically, mix it longer and more
> thoroughly. Scrape the walls of the cup and
> bottom but avoid introducing bubbles. The finish
> will appear marbled, then cloudy, then marbled
> again, and then clear, mix it until it is crystal
> clear.
>
> There is a big difference between finish mixed 99%
> and finish mixed 100%. Always mix up equal
> portions and never measure less than 3 cc's of
> each part.
>
> Once properly mixed you can pour it out on a paper
> plate covered in aluminum foil. This will extend
> the pot life and help get rid of bubbles.
>
> Click the link below to watch our short video on
> mixing Flex Coat
>
> [flexcoat.com]
> -video-on-mixing
>
> As far as your rod, if you can scratch the finish
> off with your thumb nail then you will have to
> take off the finish and wraps and start over. If
> it doesn't scratch off, then put on another coat
> that is properly mixed. It will last 20 years
> instead of 100 years.
>
> I hope this helps, let me know. You can always
> give us a call. 512-858-7742

Thanks John, I've watched all the Flex Coat videos in the past... great informative stuff. My intention certainly wasn't to put any negative light on the Flex Coat products and I admittingly messed up the ratio or didn't mix long enough, wasn't sure.. Not sure exactly how that happened as I am usually very diligent in following the proper steps. Think I just got in a hurry or distracted while finishing the rod.

Think I might give a hot parked car a try.... living in Houston, now is the perfect time!

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: July 13, 2021 02:57PM

Joel,
With respect to mixing.

When I first started building I had a couple instances of a tacky finish. When I went back to the rod building school, my tutor asked how long I was mixing the finish. I told him, "until the finish has a uniform color." He replied, "Rather than mixing by color mix by time and watch the clock. Mix for a minimum of 120 seconds or two minutes, frequently scraping off the stir stick as well as the sides of the mixing cup to be sure that 100% of the contents of the cup, including what is on the mixing stick are well mixed." After many years and hundreds of rods built, I have never had another instance of a bad mix.

I have a large clock in the work shop with a second hand on the clock. I start to mix at 12 and let the hand go for two rull revolutions while mixing to be sure that the 120 seconds have elapsed and no further issues with a bad mix.

Be safe

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Lance Schreckenbach (---.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
Date: July 13, 2021 03:14PM

Michael Danek Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Old bubbles will not pop with a little heat.
> Simply applying another coat might work. But if
> the bubbles are closed, then simply applying
> another coat will not hide them. Lightly sanding
> them to open them up and take off the edges might
> provide a clean surface on which to apply another
> coat.
>
> There is no 100% certain fix for this; it's about
> what would be most likely to succeed. I think a
> light sand, keeping out of the thread, is the most
> likely to succeed.

He did not mention anything about "old" bubbles. Maybe you are thinking about another thread. My technique will work for what he has going on, it has happened to me and this is how I fixed it. He will inevitably get bubbles with a thorough mixing, this is what I was addressing. There is no need to sand tacky epoxy, it will just cause a bigger mess.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/13/2021 03:17PM by Lance Schreckenbach.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Mark Talmo (---)
Date: July 14, 2021 12:59PM

Joel,
While possibly close, I am uncertain how close to 150*F is obtainable in a parked car so 1 or 2 extra days may be required. Might be a good idea to put a thermometer in the car to find out. While I am hoping the “post cure” heat will cure the epoxy presently on the rod, it should be enough to at least help it get closer to full cure so that a final, final coat can be applied.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Joel Babin (98.39.46.---)
Date: July 14, 2021 02:57PM

roger wilson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Joel,
> With respect to mixing.
>
> When I first started building I had a couple
> instances of a tacky finish. When I went back to
> the rod building school, my tutor asked how long I
> was mixing the finish. I told him, "until the
> finish has a uniform color." He replied, "Rather
> than mixing by color mix by time and watch the
> clock. Mix for a minimum of 120 seconds or two
> minutes, frequently scraping off the stir stick as
> well as the sides of the mixing cup to be sure
> that 100% of the contents of the cup, including
> what is on the mixing stick are well mixed."
> After many years and hundreds of rods built, I
> have never had another instance of a bad mix.
>
> I have a large clock in the work shop with a
> second hand on the clock. I start to mix at 12
> and let the hand go for two rull revolutions while
> mixing to be sure that the 120 seconds have
> elapsed and no further issues with a bad mix.
>
> Be safe

Thanks Roger, I've been using the stopwatch on my iPhone and typically mix 3-4 minutes each time I do a batch. I was applying the final coat on a 7' Glass rod from Seeker and my first batch of final coat started to get a little harder than I wanted, so I mixed up a second catch of final coat to finish the guides and that's were the issue came from. I think I may have rushed it either on the mixing time or actual blend ratio. The first batch of final coat was perfect, the second batch of final coat was still tacky as of yesterday. I got rushed as I was trying to get that second batch of final coat mixed up.

I mention it was a glass blank as one would expect it's a much larger diameter and I just got to taking too long to coat some wraps around the split grip, hook keeper, and the first three double foot guides I used.

This morning I applied a very thin coat and have it in the dryer now. Hopefully it will be okay.

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: July 16, 2021 10:44PM

For every 20F decrease or increase in temp, the epoxy will double or halve the normal set and cure time. At 150F, you'll know in a few hours if the epoxy is going to set. It won't take days.

...........

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Re: Flex coat - Messed up mix ratio, guide coat sticky
Posted by: ben belote (---.hfc.comcastbusiness.net)
Date: July 28, 2021 05:12PM

for several years now i have been usng the pac bay premeasued epoxy packets because i make so few rods in a year..i purchase about a dozen packets and weighh each one on powder scales to see if there is any varation in weight, there is none so i know the ratios are accuate..so far i have gotten well cured hard finishes..

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