I have a 9 ft jig pole that I like the action because of the fantastic way it handles catching a fish but it's a jig pole and I am using it as a casting rod but need more cast length of very light jigs. The jig pole has jig pole line guides. The lowest line guides (butt guides and up) on a spinning rod are much larger than the other guides but on a jig pole, they don’t vary as much in size. I assume that a spinning rod is like this due to the fact that line is flying off the reel and the larger guides nearer the butt makes the whirling line have an easier entry through the other guides, that it doesn't choke speed as much, equating to longer casts?

If I simply replaced the butt guide to a much bigger one, do you think cast length would improve? Or, what else could one do? Replace several or all? With a certain type? If I chose not to tackle it (no experience), I would try to find someone to do it.

Related question… take this jig pole that I really like… if I can't get a good mod done, is there any way to measure its bend (and any other parameters) and figure out why it behaves so well bringing in a fish… and have a rod maker (hopefully) duplicate this action with a custom build?

So, the two biggies are... the feel that the rod provides bringing in fish... and the length of cast of light jigs, such as 1/64 oz.

Granted, these two might not be attainable together... I don't know! TIA!

If it is a casting rod and you are using it for crappie the stripper guide (guide closest to the reel) should be a ring size 6 or 12 mm depending on the height. A Fuji RV 6 mm for the stripper (because it is tall) followed by all 5 mm KB and KT to the tip, I would say 11 to 12 guides total, will most likely cast the farthest. I would use a 5 mm Fuji KB after the stripper followed by KB 4 MM to the last 3 guides at the tip being Fuji KT guides. You want to align the guides in the straightest path with the stripper and the next two guides being aligned in a bullseye when you look through the stripper down to the tip. If you go with a larger stripper on a small level wind casting reel, it will allow the line to create waves keeping it from a straight path and you will lose distance. You do not have to use Fuji guides but similar ones with those ring sizes. You probably will not find another guide manufacturer with a tall 6 mm guide so that is why you would use a 12 mm, for the height. A rod built like this will retrieve differently than your current set up if it is not built similarly. If you are having a problem with distance, 9 times out of 10, it is probably the reel.

Hello Lance, thanks for replying. It is not a casting rod, as I said, it is a jig pole. As for it being the reel, I am doubting that in this instance, as it's not designed for casting but that is what I am doing. And I want more distance with it because I like the way it feels when I bring in a fish.

If it is, indeed, the reel, I might could remedy that by putting one of my high quality spinning reels on it.

It's just a regular jig pole. Has a spinning reel seat. So, I have an ultralight spinning reel on it.

Let me make this clear -- this rod feels the way I want a rod to feel when 'fighting' a fish during the retrieve. I have pretty high end JDM rods that cost way, way more than this and it feels better than they do. And it's not as delicate. I think it is built on IM6 graphite blank.

In essence, I am trying to turn a jig pole into a spinning rod for casting.

=

Lance Schreckenbach Wrote:
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> If it is a casting rod and you are using it for
> crappie the stripper guide (guide closest to the
> reel) should be a ring size 6 or 12 mm depending
> on the height. A Fuji RV 6 mm for the stripper
> (because it is tall) followed by all 5 mm KB and
> KT to the tip, I would say 11 to 12 guides total,
> will most likely cast the farthest. I would use a
> 5 mm Fuji KB after the stripper followed by KB 4
> MM to the last 3 guides at the tip being Fuji KT
> guides. You want to align the guides in the
> straightest path with the stripper and the next
> two guides being aligned in a bullseye when you
> look through the stripper down to the tip. If you
> go with a larger stripper on a small level wind
> casting reel, it will allow the line to create
> waves keeping it from a straight path and you will
> lose distance. You do not have to use Fuji guides
> but similar ones with those ring sizes. You
> probably will not find another guide manufacturer
> with a tall 6 mm guide so that is why you would
> use a 12 mm, for the height. A rod built like this
> will retrieve differently than your current set up
> if it is not built similarly. If you are having a
> problem with distance, 9 times out of 10, it is
> probably the reel.

I modify a lot of crappie jig pole to crappie spinning rods every year. If you want a rod that will cast light lures a long way convert it into a KR spinning rod. You can use either light mono or light braid it will work very well with a 1000 size spinning reel. To keep the weight low I have used PacBay Minima M and F guides in a KR-like build, they are quite light and in the chrome finish are very inexpensive. However, I recently purchased some SeaGuide HLG match guides (16H, 8H, and 5H) for the reduction train, and MKG size 4 guides for runners. I got them with a gun smoke Adaman finish. They are really nice guides, look great, and are relatively in expensive. I Iike them a lot. You can also use the Fuji KR guides, they are a little heavier and more expensive but also work extremely well. Try the conversion to a spinning rod you will like it. If you need specific help with the layout let us know.
Norm

The first thing that needs to be known is what line type and pound test you're using and the second most pertinent question is what size is your butt guide on the rod and what's it's distance from the reels face . Those two questions will determine everything going forward.


I want to know why your rod/reel setup is not casting well because it should IF the butt guide is of the appropriate size and spaced correctly and whether the line choice is appropriate to be a good match for the butt guide or not .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/13/2021 10:43PM by chris c nash.

These are really old Salters jig poles that have been modified. The green one with the plastic spool is an unmolested original. The other two mahogany colored ones are what the salters looks like after careful sanding with a Dewalt orbital affixed to a vice. I've made several with a new reel seat placed 12" from the butt and several with the reel seat at or near the butt. Two running guides on the first section and the remainder are inexpensive guides from Mudhole. I like to use the Trigger Spin for the lower seated rods and spinning reels for the higher location. If you look closely, the green one and the dark mahogany one are actually 4 piece blanks that have been glued together by Salters. The #6 guides keep the wet line suspended below the blank keeping the line from "sticking" to the blank and allowing for more efficient flow with light weight jigs.

Hello Chris. Once again, the rod is a jig pole. My perception is that that means it's primary use is for jigging, not casting.

The jig pole rod has a butt guide ID of 7.97 mm
A high priced JDM XUL rod I have... 13.85 mm
A low priced UL rod which I have... 20.56 mm

So, you can see why I say that the subject rod doe NOT have a butt guide near as big as spinning rods have. (But once again, the jig pole has a spinning reel seat, that's what you put on there if you want to cast a reel instead of an inexpensive jig reel that you put on just to hand strip line off to reach your desired water depth to do your jigging.)

I am new to extra ultralight fishing and am experimenting with lines. The lines I have been using are 2-5 lb test. I have used...

5 lb braid
4 lb mono
3.0 lb nylon (I think that is the type)
2.3 lb super ester
2.0 lb copolymer

The small test lines are a pain to use, hard to tie knots and my lakes have snags, so, breakoffs are a bummer. I find I can bend a hook on the 4 lb mono and 5 lb braid but I fear that they will be found to be too big for achieving desirable cast length. Verdict is not in.

The distance from the butt guide to the reel face is about 31.75".

EDIT: The jig pole handle not only has a spinning reel seat but the entire handle is a spinning rod type handle. (As opposed to a jig pole that has a jig reel seat at the butt of the handle instead of midway like a spinning rod has.)


=

chris c nash Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The first thing that needs to be known is what
> line type and pound test you're using and the
> second most pertinent question is what size is
> your butt guide on the rod and what's it's
> distance from the reels face . Those two
> questions will determine everything going
> forward.
>
>
> I want to know why your rod/reel setup is not
> casting well because it should IF the butt guide
> is of the appropriate size and spaced correctly
> and whether the line choice is appropriate to be a
> good match for the butt guide or not .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2021 10:11AM by Bill Pittman.

What.brand jig pole are you using?
Norm

As you mentioned, jig poles are not designed for casting lures. This is one of the reasons the butt guide is a small low profile casting guide, and placed so far away from the face of the reel. For a spinning rod the butt guide should be a much higher framed guides about 18” to 21” in front of the reel spool. For the 9’ jig poles I’ve modified, I use a size 16 high frame guide butt guide, with the choke guide about 31” in front of the butt guide. I progressively space two reduction (8H, and 5H or 5.5M) guides between the butt and choke guide, and progressively space the additional running guides between the choke guide and tip top. For a 9’ rod I normally use 11 guides total (3 reduction guides and 8 running guides). This set up will cast light lures a long way.
Norm

Bill,
With your jigging pole that you want to use further away from you, just add another 10 feet to the butt of the pole.

p.s. Where I am from, we actually call these dabbling poles. We like to dabble the surface of the water and really enjoy it when fish come out of their lair and smash the lure or bait on the end of the line.

Jig rods normally do not have a reel on them. Rather, the line is run through the guides and the line is tied to the butt of the pole and the amount of line left hanging from the tip, is the amount of line that you use to catch fish.

So, just take the appropriate sized 10 foot extension for the butt of the rod - put them together and go fishing with your new 20 foot pole with its now 20 foot reach.

Best wishes.

p.s.
Here is the dictionary definition of "Dabbling". Hence when we dabble the lure or bait into the water - this translates to a "dabbling" pole.
[www.google.com]

Take care

"Once again, the rod is a jig pole. My perception is that that means it's primary use is for jigging, not casting"

Yes, I understand that but despite that fact you have made it clear that you want to turn the rod that is not built for casting into a rod that casts well while retaining the rods current fish fighting ability . To do that you need to change a few things specifically meaning the butt guide size , height and positioning .


You have also made it clear that the spinning reel you're using despite being spooled with super light line is still not casting well or up to your satisfaction , that's because you have a butt guide that is approx 7 mm in ring size that is not only the wrong size but also the wrong height to achieve good casting results . The positioning at 31.75" is clearly A OK and many would place the butt guide closer to the reel face , approx 10 inches further in but you need to change it to a guide like a high frame 16 mm. The problem is you are wanting something that the rod was clearly not built to do . Like you said it was built to jig and the fact that you decided to go with a spinning reel seat and a longer spinning type of handle means nothing. It's still going to cast abysmal regardless of what reel and line you use unless you make changes to the butt guide .


The running guides , how many and where positioned and what size have far more to do with how well a rod fights a fish than the butt guide does . As long as the butt guide is not placed way out where you would lose a lot of power of the lower blank while fighting fish the rod will remain a stellar fish fighter . Change the butt guide and keep it relatively close to the reel face ( Closer than 31.75" ) and you will now have an impressive casting / jigging rod.

On a 9 foot rod of this design, I would personally place the stripper guide at 36 inches.

I would agree with Roger except for the fact that Bill is using a tiny spinning reel and 4 pound braid or 4 pound mono, what would be the purpose of moving the butt guide further out with such ridiculously light line and a tiny spinning reel . What you accomplish is giving up more of the blanks lower end power while gaining zero advantages elsewhere . Now , if Bill was going to leave the guide sizes the same and just move the butt guide then it would make perfect sense but it still wouldn't be a great choice, changing the butt guide is the right choice IF Bill wants to retain all the fighting characteristics of his rod but also wants the rod to cast better . Bill your line choices are ideal for ultimate casting distance , your comment stating that you think the line choices are too big is not the case .



Apologies to Roger , my mistake . I thought Roger was talking about this particular build but he was talking about jigging rods he typically builds .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/14/2021 10:31PM by chris c nash.

Thanks much for the posts, will review again! Suffice to say, it looks like cast distance could be improved.

Bill,
Norman is spot on if you want to convert it to a light spinning rod. His guide train is correct for the small size reel, and I also really like Seaguide guides. I believe you could do between 24" and 30" for the stripper (16 mm ring size) from the face of the spinning reel. Then align the next 3 guides like a bullseye to the choke point, looking through the stripper. Keep the line as straight as possible. Monofilament line is typically nylon or co- and multi-polymers mixed in to varying degrees to change the line properties. You may want to consider a thin limp line like braid, to me it works better on a spinning reel. Mono is also very good, but I have tried fluorocarbon and did not like it on spinning reels because it is too stiff.
Tight Lines,
Lance

Rod blank manufacturers bust hump and advertising budgets trying to design rods which excel for particular uses: jerk baits, worming, trolling, dry flies, wet flies, streamers, slip-bobbers, dough balls - you name it. Still, some rod builders strive to convert a trolling rod into a casting rod?!!! I'm not complaining - it's the fringe where progress occurs.

Many crappie jig poles are actually built on very nice graphite blanks, but use cheap components. They are usually built with a spinning reel seat a full length rear grip and an extra long fore grip. The stripper guide is usually a size 10 or 12 double foot casting guide followed by single ft runners. They are designed to be used with any type of small reel, since the reel is only used to hold and store line, casting is not involved. This type of rod works very well for vertically presenting small jigs or minnows, and catch millions of crappie every year. Many of these modern Crappie jigging rods can be converted into extremely nice spinning rods that can cast a light lure a very long way. Some of the graphite blanks they use are very light, with a nice crisp action and feel. Rod builders cannot buy these type of blanks; I wish I could. The closest thing to them are light powered fast to moderate fast steelhead blanks. I’ve probably modified several hundred crappie jig poles into spinning rods over the past decade or so. Some companies like B’n’M do sell a spinning version made from the same blank as their jig poles. However, the components they use are very inexpensive with no frills. Most Crappie fishermen just don’t want to pay a lot for a rod. However, some do want a higher performing spinning rod with higher quality components. I’m positive this is what Bill wants done with his jig pole.
Norm

So I guess I can stop searching for a 2 piece graphite crappie pole.

Mark - a lot of people will buy a crappie jig pole they like the feel of, strip it down, and build a surprisingly nice spin rod on it. Good crappie jig pole are quite inexpensive, $50 to $70, and thus are a pretty good deal. Problem is it takes some work to convert them to a spin rod, depending on how you want to modify it. However, it is fun to do, and you learn a lot. If you ever find a good source of blanks suitable for long crappie spin rods, let me know.
Norm

I am trying to track down the source of the graphite 2 piece jig poles that I have been stripping down. They are straight up sacalait jig poles complete with cheap plastic basic reel, golf grip tape, and diaper pin looking runners. So far I've modified 5 of them. The original builder sold hundreds of them here in south Louisiana.