It's been quite a while since I have used Fuji guides much, mostly running Alps and CRB stainless SSR. Both of these have a pretty good foot prep from the factory.

I have been thinking of re-visiting Fuji guides, but the last ones I got had no foot prep at all. Are they still this way or do they have some these days?

Thanks!

I can't claim to have seen or used every Fuji guide family. But those I do use don't have any and I actually prefer them that way. I have used guides that were "pre-prepped" and the work was so poor that it required additional work on my part to rectify the shoddy job already done and get them to where the guides were, in my opinion, good to wrap.

............

I only use Fuji KL-H , KW 10M's , RV , KB and KT Fuji's and out of 7 different set's of RV 25 and RV 16's I prepped two of them all the rest I found satisfactory to wrap as they come. I believe most do prep the Fuji's they get especially the larger versions.

Thanks!!

All I do is a light scrub of 150 sandpaper across the foot, nothing else for KT's, KB's, KLH's up to size 20. . I'd rather not grind away the orignial finish, don't have to to get a good wrap.

I use a light file on all of my guides. A lot of the guides I have used say they are prepped but in my opinion, not very well. I like a very smooth transition from the blank up onto the foot. I despise seeing that little area of the tip of the foot showing after the wrap is on. My wraps are very tight or I redo them. I just went down and looked at a bunch of guides I have. They all are "pre ground" but still need some prep for a good wrap.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/26/2021 09:14AM by Todd Andrizzi.

It's always best not to break through the finish on any guide to maintain the effectiveness of whatever finish or treatment the manufacturer has used. Any removal of material will, in effect, "void the warranty" of the component. Even Polished stainless, when "scuffed", is much more likely to fail over time since it is the level of polish that provides the protective "vapor barrier" that fights corrosion. Spend a little time learning to climb an unfiled foot, it will pay off in the end. If you must file, use a stone, any microscopic steel particles left from a file will eventually turn orange as they oxidate, leaving you with the false idea that the guide rusted. "Raw" stainless generally pits with a bunch of tiny microscopic holes that go all the way through the foot. The pits may show a slight green color but not orange. At some point, the foot just falls off because of all the holes. Best defense is an untouched "factory" finish from a quality manufacturer.

...and I wrote that whole post without even using the word "Fuji"!!

Thanks Jim. I don't know any of that material. A question I thought of while reading was...If the entire foot and especially the area scuffed is properly covered with finish, isn't the area then sealed and shouldn't be exposed to moisture? I have built rods that are now 15 years old and have been fished a lot and I don't see rust or discoloration any where. I am a very critical person when it comes to any kind of work being done so I like to know this information.

The Fuji guides don't need much prep if any. Jim says you need to learn how to wrap without prep and that Fuji stainless is less likely to corrode if not prepped. I agree with the idea of jumping up on the foot and burnishing the thread back to the end of the foot tip, but sometimes it doesn't work out and you just have to bring the foot thickness down to make a better transition. I am not sure what grade of stainless steel that Fuji uses for their guide frames but I do know it corrodes in saltwater environments, so in that respect, unless it is coated or plated, grinding on the foot is not going to change it that much to corrode any faster. It will also be covered with epoxy completely over the foot and if done correctly will not be an issue. So Jim, what is the grade of stainless steel that Fuji uses for its stainless steel guide frames? Next time I can get my hands on a PMI tester, I will try to get a breakdown on the element composition of the Fuji frames and post it if we can't get an answer.

In theory, moisture will never reach the foot, Todd. In the real world, there's a fair chance that over time the epoxy on the forward side of the foot (where the frame legs bend up) will pop away from the blank under load. That's all it takes. If you haven't experienced this you've done it all right. To reduce those chances, we recommend stopping the epoxy (and sometimes the wrap as well) before you get to the area where things start to bend. That way, the foot and epoxy and thread sort of "float" on the blank and the guide foot cannot act like a lever and pull epoxy off the blank. I'm talking mostly reduction guides on spinning rods, there are places where epoxy and even wraps are OK far forward - like short foot-print runners or double foot guides. If you see a "web" of epoxy in front of the guide foot, there's a reasonable chance the epoxy will pop loose at some point. Keep that "web" as small as possible or non-existent. I learned from Billy Vivona to pull a clean piece of thread across that point to remove as much epoxy as possible. Like "flossing" the bend upward ahead of the guide foot. Note: it's not as easy as it sounds and can be messy till you learn it. Depending on your finishing technique you may never have this problem. If you have I hope this helps.

Fuji uses and has used a 304 stainless for 30+ years and managed to outperform the competition. We hear the 316 argument all the time but it's well accepted that the POLISH on stainless is where the corrosion resistant barrier comes from and the polish on Fuji stainless is unmatched in the industry. You don't need any PMI testing to get us to tell the truth. In fact, we have expanded our selection of POLISHED stainless for 2021.

Thanks Jim, That is good info to try.

Most if not all of ALPS guides have S-6 316 stainless frames . It's a slightly softer steel with better corrosion resistance then 304 stainless . I haven't had issues with Fuji or ALPS guide frames.

That sounds like another good reason to use the forhan locking wraps..they stablize that end of the guide..

Here is a quick photo of the first spinning rod I grabbed. This a size 20 KL-H stripper showing the amount of "web" in front of the guide that will reduce or eliminate the guide epoxy popping away from the blank. No pop, no corrosion. If you fill the tunnels along the side of the foot properly the epoxy will ooze out the open end of the wrap and that is usually enough. No need to pile epoxy on the base of the frame.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

I'm putting my sandpaper away. I do know how to wrap without having to use it. Just have been a little lazy.

All but two of the rods I've built have had Fuji guides on them. And because of the amount of thread tension I use, I have felt the need to prep every one of them at least a little bit. Some more than others. I only fish freshwater, so I'm not really worried about the corrosion factor being spoken of. My thinking is that in freshwater that kind of corrosion is going to take a long time to show itself. I guess I'll just have to wait and see if that thinking is right.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/28/2021 07:07AM by David Baylor.

Jim Ising Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Here is a quick photo of the first spinning rod I
> grabbed. This a size 20 KL-H stripper showing the
> amount of "web" in front of the guide that will
> reduce or eliminate the guide epoxy popping away
> from the blank. No pop, no corrosion. If you fill
> the tunnels along the side of the foot properly
> the epoxy will ooze out the open end of the wrap
> and that is usually enough. No need to pile epoxy
> on the base of the frame.
>
> [www.rodbuilding.org]
> p/photo/21656/title/img-4572/cat/500

I have found if you wrap up the neck the guide a little and then in front of the foot the epoxy won't crack as easy, just don't get a build up of epoxy past the thread. I have had the Fuji stainless steel guides corrode many times, and have replace many corrode Fuji SS guides. I assume that is why they made the CC coating on them. I will use the Ti framed guides but they are only offering them with Torzite and SIC rings and are quite expensive. I do use the SS frames on freshwater rods and have not had the same issues. They are a great value especially with the Alconite rings.

Jim is offering great advice. I have mentioned in the past that some should look at welding forums.

The problem is that you are contaminating the base metal from residue left in your file/stone. It doesn't matter how well encapsulated the guide is. Rather or not this will become a problem down the road depends on a myriad of circumstances. Doesn't change the fact that you have done harm.

I'll dress the backside of the guide if there is a burr I have to remove. Otherwise, I'll use D thread and double wrap if I must before I'll grind guide feet. With Fuji I seldom need more than a single layer of A thread and a little care climbing up the foot.

I have 40+ years experience in a hospital maintenance setting. Most of that has been in a salt water environment. I can tell you it is more about the quality of the finished item and less about 316 vs 304. I have so called 316 that is coffee colored in a few years and 18/8, 304 that is pristine after 40 years. Don't even get me started on titanium.

Good companies spend a lot of time on coatings and passivation layers. You aren't doing anyone a favor by removing/defeating them. Sorry if this isn't what you want to hear.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

Yes, I also agree with Jim. I never prep the foot of any Fuji guides I use. I have no problems wrapping up the toe of these guides. I just don’t see the sense in removing the passivation layer or the corrosion control finish, you are just asking for trouble by doing so.
Norm