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Guide spacing
Posted by: Ralph Winkler (---)
Date: September 15, 2020 07:41AM

My 6'6" st Croix spinning legend ultra mf broke.
I am rebuilding on 6'6" legend elite mlf.
I note the St. Croix guide spacing chart lists different spacing than my old rod, which performed well.

1. Can I safely transfer my old guides and spacing to the new blank, or will that cause problems?

2. If I must follow the current spacing guide, who would sell a set of Fuji guides identical to St Croix? Their chart lists size/spacing but not exact model of Fuji guides....and there seem to be a lot of choices.

Thanks for any help. It has been 40 years since I built my last rods.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Joe Vanfossen (---.neo.res.rr.com)
Date: September 15, 2020 09:07AM

Hi Ralph, welcome aboard!

You can transfer your old guides over and things will work just like they have in the past. A blank is a blank and as long as you have enough guides to keep it from failing it will be ok.

That said, rather than mimicking a production rod or what you have done in the past, over the last 10-15 years or so, spinning guide trains have come a long way. Some food for thought:

[www.rodbuilding.org]
[anglersresource.net]
[www.americantackle.us]

All three are variations on the theme of taking the line to the blank in a straight line and then using all of the same sized guides to the tip to keep the line path as straight as possible.

By using smaller and lighter guides throughout the build, you will end up with a rod that is more efficient than a traditional cone of flight type build utilizing a bunch of guide sizes.

Hope this helps!

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: John DeMartini (---)
Date: September 15, 2020 09:25AM

Assemble the rod less the guides. Transfer the guides from the broken rod and tape them in place. Practice cast and and fish with it, the tape will hold for a day or two. If you are happy with the results wrap the guides and finish it and enjoy the rod.If not relocate the guides and try again. If still not satisfied purchase a different style of guides tape them on and compare the results. Experimenting is part of the fun of rod crafting

Have fun

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---)
Date: September 15, 2020 04:52PM

Distrust any advise about guide train choice, orientation, spacing, or numbers which violate known and confirmed laws of physics - unless you believe a rod should be an exclusive work of art rather than an efficient tool.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: John DeMartini (---)
Date: September 15, 2020 05:23PM

Distrust any advice that stresses fractions of a gram can be the difference between success or failure. Success or failure is purely subjective. Remember one mans desert is another mans poison. My favorite rod could be someone else's nightmare.

You do not have to be a scientist or be knowledgeable in physics to be a rod crafter.

Common sense and acquired experience will do.

Build the rod that feels good to you and makes you happy.

Have fun.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: September 15, 2020 06:46PM

Ralph,
Since your broken rod is an excellent rod, leave the guides along and repair the broken rod. I simple enough procedure, just refer to the forum library for complete instructions.

Then, pick out a guide set of your choice, build the new rods and enjoy them both.

Plenty of wonderful guides of many different manufacturers on the market. Choose the set you like, and build the rod well and all will be well.

With respect to guide spacing.

In a nut shell, place a guide on the blank anywhere that a loaded blank needs a guide to insure a smooth line flow. Then, for size and height, just choose a guide set that will give the line a nice straight clean flow to the tip top of the rod and you will have a winning rod.

You really don't need recipes, software or other aids. Just a tape measure your eyes and sense of balance, and you will have a perfect guide setup every time with respect to rod guide height, size and spacing.

Take care

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Lynn Behler (---.97.252.156.res-cmts.leh.ptd.net)
Date: September 15, 2020 09:00PM

Legend Elites being sold now feature Fuji Kr guide trains.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Ralph Winkler (---)
Date: September 16, 2020 05:10AM

At 68, I sometimes find myself ".com challenged". But finding this site and the friendly help available....thank you all.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Robert Flowers (---)
Date: September 17, 2020 03:27PM

A site for Fuji Gujides - [www.mudhole.com]

Be aware, there are other great guides on the market, each with its own advantages and disadvantages. If your are looking for durability, and corrosion resistance, you migt consider these - [www.mudhole.com] with their running guides and tip top. They are pure titanium, and so are, for all practicle purposes, indestructable, and corrosion free.

Another very popular option is the American Tackle Microwave guides that claim to manage the line better so that you can cast further. The reviews I've read here on R, and on other sites seem to back this up. You can purchase them here - [www.mudhole.com],

You can also get them here - [www.anglersworkshop.com]

There are less costly guides at both Mudhole.com, and Angler's Workshop. They also have guide placement charts as well. I hope your repair, or build goes great. Look up the stress load test in the library here to get an idea on how to best place your guides. The charts are a great starting point.

Tight lines and frisky fish

RJF

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Norman Miller (---)
Date: September 17, 2020 05:01PM

Don’t buy the Mudhole Fuji KR guide kits! Some don’t use the proper reduction guide pairings, all use a four guide reduction trains, and they base guide usage on rod length not reel and line size. Buy the guides individually..
Norm

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---)
Date: September 21, 2020 03:51PM

Should the diameter of the line being used or the type of line (nylon monofilament, gel-spun braid, etc.) be considered when selecting guides and spacing them? These variables are seldom mentioned in discussions of guide spacing.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Robert A. Guist (---.inf6.spectrum.com)
Date: September 22, 2020 10:25AM

Hello Phil.

They are covered by "The line shouldn't..."


Tight Wraps & Tighter Lines.

Bob,

New Bern, NC.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---)
Date: September 23, 2020 07:52AM

Robert:

I take it you mean "one size fits all" - allowing for decreasing guide size from first guide to tip-top, of course. That's good. Fewer and lighter guides mean longer casts.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Robert A. Guist (---.inf6.spectrum.com)
Date: September 23, 2020 11:36AM

Hello Phil.

No Phil that is not what I meant, I meant that I consider type & size line, in as they shouldn't go below the blank in any build accept spinning and some builds (roller for instance) should not touch the blank in any way.

Yes you can put any line on your rod you want but it does not mean it will work well with that line, however it can be improved by following some rules (think of all the rules covering "the line shouldn't...").

You select guides for looks, height, & materials, the height is the "main reason" line is considered, spacing the "second reason" lie is considered.

Hope you can understand what I'm saying now.


Tight Wraps & Tighter Lines.

Bob,

New Bern, NC.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: September 25, 2020 08:39AM

Monofilament lines, particularly in larger diameters, particularly in cold weather, retain their loop shape when they come off a spinning reel. You can even hear the difference as your line slaps its way through the guide train. An increase in the I.D. of guides reduces this problem.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: John C. Allgood (---)
Date: October 01, 2020 09:40PM

Robert A. Guist Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
"they shouldn't go below the blank in any build accept spinning"

??? By 'they' do you mean the guides?

If so, I disagree. All guides want to be on the bottom of the blank under load (when you have a fish on). This is the basis for the "spiral or revolver" wrap on conventional bait casting rods. When under load, guides try to move to the bottom of the blank. This "torque' becomes more noticeable with bigger fish. Not as noticeable with smaller fish but it still exists.

This is easily demonstrated with one of the little cheap "snoopy" kids spin cast rods. Holding the rod upright, pull straight down on the line and these soft little rods will twist until the guides are below the blank while the reel remains fixed to the top of the blank. Remove the load (stop pulling on the line) and they twist back to the top of the rod. The guides are not moving, the rod is twisting under load.

If that is not what you meant, I apologize for disagreement.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: Robert A. Guist (---.inf6.spectrum.com)
Date: October 02, 2020 10:21AM

Hello John.

I was speaking of the line.


Tight Wraps & Tighter Lines.

Bob,

New Bern, NC.

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Re: Guide spacing
Posted by: John C. Allgood (---.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net)
Date: October 02, 2020 09:23PM

Hi Bob.

The line is what pulls the guides to the bottom of the blank and creates torque on the rod. A force that its always there when you have a fish on. Spinning rods have the guides on the bottom of the blank and don't suffer from this effect.

A conventional bait caster with the guides on top (traditional way to build them) will certainly land big fish but it is more efficient with the guides on the bottom of the blank like a spinning rod. This completely eliminates the torque effect.




"We has found the enemy and they is us." Pogo

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