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CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: Mark Talmo (---)
Date: September 11, 2020 11:36PM

Without the luxury of having Ralph O’Quinn to consult, what makes CP oblivious to (silicone) contamination versus simple epoxy application over a decal? Many of you coat decals with CP prior to the epoxy application to avoid the dreaded contamination effect where the epoxy is repealed over the surface of the decal. How can a water based acrylic “seal” the surface when silicone and water notoriously do not mix and inherently repel each other? I am here to learn!

Mark Talmo

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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: Michael Sutheimer (---.wi.res.rr.com)
Date: September 12, 2020 04:45AM

Could be wrong but my theory is this. Yes silicone repels water. But when you coat a decal you don't just coat the decal. I apply the CP to a rotating rod. So I have a coating of CP all the way around the rod. Even if you apply just to the label without roatating you are going to have CP on the blank around the edges. So you in essence have a shell of CP over the label. While the adhesion to the label is virtually nothing the CP is adhered very well to the blank. For the limited exposure and handling the CP is stuck enough to the label to get you through the finishing process.

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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: September 12, 2020 07:21AM

CP isn't applied to a decal to correct silicone contamination. Your decal shouldn't have any silicone on your decal to begin with.


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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: Robert A. Guist (---.inf6.spectrum.com)
Date: September 12, 2020 11:21AM

Hello Mark.

The only reason I use CP on a decal is to coat the edges so epoxy can't get under the edge of the decal and lift it.

Tight Wraps & Tighter Lines.


New Bern, NC.

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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: Charlie Armontrout (---.unassigned.ntelos.net)
Date: September 15, 2020 08:16AM

If the decal was created with a high quality adhesive layer, and applied properly by rolling to "set the adhesive layer", then the epoxy would never find a way under the edges at any time. Rod thread epoxies are not agressive in the fact of wanting to dissolve anything they come in contact with so they don't try to attack the decal adhesive like Acetone or Xylene. Xylene is used in the formulation of Perma Gloss....these two chemicals are quite agressive! CP should be used for what it was designed for - preserving color in thread. (note: I do not use CP for anything in my rod building)

Silicone repels EVERYTHING and should NEVER be brought anywhere near a rod building facility. It is taboo for rodbuilders as we need it for absolutely nothing. GOOGLE silicone and read how easy it is to remove, clean-up, get rid of, etc. Armor-All that is used for making one's vehicles and boats look snappy is also taboo.....once you touch it it follows you everywhere - probably worse than COVID because if you can't get a finish to stay where you put it on a rod, that will make you sick!!

Thanks for reading and keep 'em turnin' . . . .!


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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: ben belote (---.zoominternet.net)
Date: September 20, 2020 04:06PM

CP is also used for sealing guide wraps..this is just as important as color preservation..you can,t get epoxy to level on an unsealed wrap unless you keep gooping on the epoxy and end up with a wrap that weighs more than the guide itself..

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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: Russell Brunt (---.lightspeed.miamfl.sbcglobal.net)
Date: September 20, 2020 06:43PM

Wow Ben. Surprised to hear you say that. Granted my builds are blanks in the 8-15# to 20-40# range. Still I never felt like CP made any difference in how much epoxy I had to put on a guide wrap. I'd say using D thread vs A thread makes a far bigger difference.

No doubt you are right. I can't say I have ever bothered to weigh the difference.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: ben belote (---.zoominternet.net)
Date: September 20, 2020 07:49PM

hi Russell..rods that you build can easily carry the small differences i,m talking about..people who build fly rods or light to ultra light rods are more concerned about guide and wrap weights..for me that,s why the sealing of threads with CP are important..epoxy will level so much better on a sealed wrap..it doesn,t need to sink in and saturate the wrap..the wrap has already been saturated with the CP which is so much lighter than epoxy..you can apply a much thinner coat on a CP treated wrap and most times only the one coat of epoxy, paint thin if you want..i,m talking about personal rods not rods for sale..most buyers like the look of fat epoxy wraps and that,s fine..watch Roger Seiders of flex coat apply epoxy onU-Tube on unsealed wraps and how he goops it on and bangs on it with the brush to get penetration, and that,s just the first coat..then watch Tom Kirkman on U-Tube apply just one coat of epoxy as thick or thin as he wants with just a couple passes of the brush and he,s done..but his wraps are sealed..you can only do that with sealed wraps or you have to work at it like Roger..yes, CP sealed wraps make a big difference in swing weight for fly rods and make epoxy application go so much smoother and trouble free, no bubble problems at all, they have been sealed out..lol..

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Re: CP as a Contaminaion Barrier
Posted by: Timothy Fisher (---.hsd1.or.comcast.net)
Date: September 26, 2020 08:26PM

In general then what do people use to coat a decal and how do they do it? I coated the blank with Klass Kote which I'm almost positive will destroy the sticker. I'm doing Flex Coat on my wraps but I'm afraid that if I try to put it on the sticker it will just turn into an ugly mess on the turner. I suppose I could roll the epoxy all the way around the blank covering the sticker but I'm afraid that will look stupid too. FWIW it's a water adhesive sticker from Pac Bay. I t went on easy and stuck almost instantly and looks very nice so I don't want to blow it doing something stupid lol.

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