Having built two fly rods recently, a 9 ft. 6 wt and a 9 ft 5 wt., I tried both with NOS SA Mastery GPX fly lines I had purchased a few years ago and had not yet used. Wow, I found the lines to be so aggreisve in their weight forward, half-size heavy taper that I felt like I had an anvil on the end of the line. The 6 weiight is a Baston Eternity2, so a pretty fast, high-quality graphite rod. I guess it all comes down to personal preference and type of fishing, but I find some of these new taper to have far too much weight in the forward taper. I have fished Rio Gold, which I still find a bit too aggressive. How do others feel? For folks who want a more traitioanal feel (as seems to be my case), what lines do you recommend? I probably dry fly fish 50% of the time and my place of fishing is in streams and rivers in the Rockies. I was thinking maybe a Rio Technical Trout.

For many years there was something known as a "Bass Bug Taper" (WF) and it featured the assigned weight over the first 20 to 25 feet instead of the first 30. These lines can be good if you are casting larger, wind resistant flies. They also allow for short pickup and re-cast without need for any false casting. But... they are probably not as versatile as standard taper lines. Got to remember, specialty lines are made for a specific task, or two, and are not likely to be the best for all-around use.

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David, those lines are probably meant for the higher air resistant dry flys, even bass bugs would give a better balance..i use 720grain spey shooting head line turned backwards to get the heavy end forward for extra large bass bugs..without a bug tied on the line is almost uncontrolable but with the bug tied on it cast smoothly even into a
good wind..

Two basic facts determine the "best fly line" for an individual: the conditions where the line will be used and the proficiency of the angler. I would hesitate under any circumstances to recommend a line because of its "feel", because that depends entirely upon the angler.

The aggressive taper lines are great when you need to make very long casts or in heavy wind. Lines like Rio Gold are 1/2 weight heavier than the nominal weights, Rio Grand is a full weight heaver. The Rio Perception is a more traditional taper. I fish all three depending upon the conditions. I have not fished the Rio Technical.

I find the old Lee Wulff Triangle Tapers and their imitators to be very effective for distance casts, even though it tapers from a smaller to a larger diameter for 35' or so. It roll-casts nicely too, but I up line one weight to get the best results with a "fast action" rod. It's still the same old "triangle" consisting of caster, rod, and line: ALL three must be right to achieve good results

Like Phil, I have really liked the Triangle Taper lines since they came out in the early 90's. Looking back I see that, the Rainshadow blanks I've used have been pretty close to the ERN ratings and not as high in AA as some, for instance the TFO TiCr line. This explains, to me why the GPX lines you mentioned work so much better on the TFO rods, it's all in the blank's power, not it's action. The ERN on the 6 wt. Batson I've checked were mid six the low sevens, while the 6 wt. TFO TiCr was mid sevens to low 8's and have always had a higher Action Angle. Both will throw the GPX line, but when you start carrying more line in the air, or you want a long roll cast, the Rainshadow just doesn't have the umpth built into the blank that the others have. Doesn't mean they aren't great rods, but the GPX lines were built for, the cannons, not the sweet casting rods.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/20/2020 09:37PM by Spencer Phipps.

"It's all in the blank's power, not it's action."

Correct and yet something that even long time fly fishermen don't seem to understand.

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Fly lines are so varied in weights and tapers nowadays that it is hard to recommend particular lines. If you are looking for a true AFFTA compliant fly line, the cortland 444 or 444SL are good choices that have stood the test of time. The 444 is peach color, has a short front taper which loads up close and is available in WF or DT. The 444 SL is mint green, has a longer front taper and is a little stiffer. My absolute favorite dry fly line is the Joan Wulff Signature triangle taper line. Slightly shorter head than the original TT, and has a more forgiving rear taper (handling line). Fantastic dry fly presentation, roll and spey casts, and I can see the white line on the water. Not the best for heavy nymph rigs and weighted streamers.It casts really well with soft or soft tip rods IMO. You may also want to consider a double taper which are great trout lines. Few anglers realize that to get the benefit of a weight forward line, one needs to carry the whole head plus the leader outside the rod tip, then shoot to the target. Many of todays lines have 40+ ft heads. 40' plus 9' leader outside 9' rod = 58' without shooting any line. How far do you want to cast to a trout?

Thanks for all the feedback. I got a great deal on a 6wt. Rio In Touch Technical Trout line, so I will try that. It's funny, I have two original Ross Gunnison G1 and G2 reels. In the 1990s I loaded them both with WF lines, but I cannot recall the make of the lines. I think they were SA Dry Cell, but not sure. A chance they may have been Cortland. Not much variety in lines back then. Both lines are a light peach/pinkish color for their entire length, and no welded loops back then. The orginal Ross reels drags were a bit of a mess, so I did not use the reels much for a number of years and instead was using an original Redington Vice reel with a 6wt Rio Gold. I had the Ross Reels rebuilt last year by the factory. A mere $60! Yeah, Ross! These two old lines are still in decent shape and they still cast great today on all my rods. The 4wt line I fish on a 1990 Sage LL 4wt. The 5 wt casts just great on a variety of 5wt rods I have, from TiCRX to Sage to Redington. They roll cast fantastically. I am looking for a line that can replicate their taper. If they were SA lines, I bet the Trout or Standard taper lines may be similar.

Rod marketers shun mention of objective measurements referring to fly rods, as does the great majority of fly fishing literature. Companies that build rods or rod blanks never mention "action" or "power," let alone apply these terms to their products.

Last time I checked, the SA Air Cel Supreme lines were accurate per the original AFTMA fly line weights. Not sure those lines are made any more, however.

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I think the AFTMA designated the line weighting system we still use more than fifty years ago, before graphite rods, to replace the old "HCH" etc. designations. I think the AFTMA ceased to exist around 40 years ago. Using arbitrary numbers like 3, 4, 5, rather than actual line weights, like grams or ounces, apparently appeals to the average fly angler. You might be surprised how much difference there can be today in the actual weight of the first 30 feet of two, say, "7 wt." lines.

AFTMA changed their name to the American Fly Fishing Trade Association (https://affta.org). While they still publish the fly line and fly reel foot dimension standards, they do not enforce them.

To know the actual size of a fly line, it is best to weigh it. Grab a cheap digital scale that can weigh in grains (look for scales that take AA or AAA batteries). Coil up the first 30 feet of the fly line and weigh it. Check against the standard chart to see what line weight you have.

For what it is worth, the double taper lines I've weighed matched the labeled line size. Many of the weight forward lines were heavier than specified.


Tom

Tom G. - I agree, but in order to know the weight of the first 30 feet of fly line [presumably the footage aerialized in a cast] your suggestion forces the fly caster to BUY the line in order to weigh it. [Not hard to guess why.] What prevents the line from being labeled with the ACTUAL WEIGHT of its first 30 feet? The rod does NOT give a hoot about the taper of the line it is casting, only its weight.

why not just ask the people running the fly shop about the weight? or are they playing the same game..

With all the new and diverse models of lines, and very little way to test drive them, it makes for an interesting consumer dynamic.

There are only so many ways to configure the first 30' of fly line. If your identification system [1-14] just loosely hints at physical reality you will still sell a lot more lines.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/20/2020 07:06PM by Phil Ewanicki.

Back before there was all these lines to confuse us, we still got the job done without costing an arm and a leg, or needing a PHD. If you were fishing close you used a line heavier than the rod's rating, if you needed to cast far, you used a line lighter than the rod's rating. If you needed to really reach out there you bought two lines, a inexpensive level line and a DT line two weights heavier than your line rating. You cut the heavy DT into two 30 ft. sections, these were your shooting heads that you loop connected to the level line. You shook your shooting head outside your rod tip, rollcasted it straight, immediately performed one backcast and threw the line easily to the backing knot if need be. With loop connections you could quickly install any type of new head in short order. Now you pay $100 + to do what took a hour of your time and a few bucks to buy and everything fit in one pocket of your vest. Caught a lot of fish that way.

Phil Ewanicki Wrote:
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> What prevents the line from being labeled with the ACTUAL WEIGHT of its first 30 feet? The rod does NOT give a hoot about the taper of the line it is casting, only its weight.

> If your identification system [1-14] just loosely hints at physical reality you will still sell a lot more lines.

Exactly! I would be happy with an accurate weight given in any units - grams, grains, or AFTMA line number. Then I can deal with all the hoopla about front tapers, back tapers, surface finish, slickness, etc. A decade ago, the big line companies posted the actual weights on their websites. Now, not so much. An understanding fly shop staff may let you to weigh before you buy. I suspect they would like the information too. Obviously, this won't work for internet sales unless the vendor has a good return policy.


Spencer Phipps Wrote:
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> If you needed to really reach out there you bought two lines, a inexpensive level line and a DT line two weights heavier than your line rating.
> You cut the heavy DT into two 30 ft. sections, these were your shooting heads that you loop connected to the level line.

I like it. Personally, I would cut the 'correct' size DT line into two 45 foot pieces. For most fishing, I could work off the DT section, with the occasional shooting head cast. As my eyesight ages, I can cast further than I can fish, particular with smaller flies.


Tom