When I set my guide spacing I use a static setup for placing. Put rod at 45 degree angle , bend rod to a 90 degree angle , run line from reel through guides and start placing to have line mimic arc of rod. I use either CRB or St Croix spacing guide chart as a start then adjust as needed to make sure line runs smoothly and follows bend of rod. If I notice an angle in line I move guides till the line smooths out. I have used this for many types of guides with no problem. I have read and watched many videos with rod builders using wild mathematical equations and it really seems they end up with same result I get. My theory if no kinks in line, smooth path it will cast perfectly fine. Yea sometimes it looks like extra eye but with line smooth it doesn't put added pressure on a guide or the pole. Next is proper guide size. Which is better, smaller or larger? Is too large a butt guide just as bad as too small on a spinner? I mean for someone using a 4 - 500 series reel does it really make difference if starting with a 25 or a 20. Would you say butt guide size is vital? Also how about the, 'rule of thumb', i hear about, that you should never drop more than 4 sizes between guides, ie. first a 20 then a 16 to 12 then runout 8, as example. Any thoughts tips tricks

The line is traveling straight and the rod is not flexed when being cast.

Most people use far too many guide sizes on most rods. There is no reason to use so many sizes, you could drop from a 20 to a 6 and the line angle drop would still be very gradual owing to the distance between the guides.

You may wish to read the New Guide Concept article in the online library here, or take a moment to look at the Anglers Resource guide sizing and placement article on their website. The MicroWave system makes things even easier.

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Tom Thanks. Yea i will check them out. So then for opinion is guide spacing more critical for casting distance or even load distribution through rod, or both.

It's needed for both it's more critical for stress distribution. You will find, however, that good guide placement aids casting performance. I wouldn't overlook either.

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Gotcha. The static guide placement article you did is excellent, and it pretty much is what I do. I do not do it in 3 steps, slight bend then more then max bend. I have noticed how bend point moves, can be pretty big, on different length and power of rods, so yea a lighter rod with bend point higher on rod I use less weight to keep bend up were it naturally wants to bend. I have found out you can over bend a rod then guides look messed up and can not get smooth run. I really try to stop and hold it at the natural bend of rod without making tip point past horizontal. I guess what i am asking now , is it redundant to use concept then static if starting of with guide charts from like St Croix, or CRB, I must use concept sort of because my last step before wrapping is looking down shaft of rod and making sure a clear line of sight. It just seems , to me of which i am probably wrong, that guide spacing isn't so complicated and no need for a PHD in math if using a guide chart then tweaking with static load.

John

It is true that a PhD isn’t necessary to set up a guide train. The fundamentals outlined in the New Guide Concept (NGC) and static testing articles will go a long way to a successful build. In fact if you look at techniques such as Fuji’s KR Concept and the American Tackle Microwave, you will find that they involve two straight lines just like the NGC. All 3 work well and give satisfactory results as do some older spacing charts that involve more sizes. This is because like most optimization problems, there are a broad range of solutions that work well. It’s not a problem with a singularly solution.

With a spinning rod choosing a butt guide with an appropriate height and placed in the right area of the blank will get you headed in the right direction. From there it’s a matter tweaking things to handle the line and load well. Beyond that making sure that the smallest guides in the layout will easily pass any required connections and you are good to go.

Joe

braided line takes all the mystery out of guide size and placement because just about everything works..i just finish making my third bow and arrow bush rod using a 61/2' glass rod, cut up to make a 5' rod that collapses to a 4' rod..the choke guide is 19" from reel face and the butt guide is 14" from the choke..the line runs from butt guide straight to the choke..i can B&A shoot up to 45'..i can,t nearly do this with mono or flouro only braided line..

ben belote Wrote:
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> braided line takes all the mystery out of guide
> size and placement because just about everything
> works..i just finish making my third bow and arrow
> bush rod using a 61/2' glass rod, cut up to make a
> 5' rod that collapses to a 4' rod..the choke guide
> is 19" from reel face and the butt guide is 14"
> from the choke..the line runs from butt guide
> straight to the choke..i can B&A shoot up to
> 45'..i can,t nearly do this with mono or flouro
> only braided line..
that should read butt guide is 14" from reel face.