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adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 19, 2020 09:32AM

I'm looking to put some narrow trim bands (2 or 3 turns) on the ends of guide wraps (not over guide feet). If I maintain tension on the ends of these narrow wraps and put a TINY speck of dry-in-seconds superglue on the "X" where the threads cross under the wraps will this spot be obvious under the epoxy finish coat on the wrappings?

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: May 19, 2020 10:48AM

Phil,
I just have to say that it won't be visible unless it is.

Do a test wrap on a broken blank and test the concept. You are doing it, your hands are doing the glue placement so - it does not matter what others do or say, because you may do it differently. Try, test, evaluate.

Best wishes

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Phil Erickson (---.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)
Date: May 19, 2020 11:09AM

If you do not use CP, it will not be visible.I do it frequently.

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Bill Hickey (---.nycap.res.rr.com)
Date: May 19, 2020 01:18PM

I'm with Roger and Phil, they can take a bit of practice to get them just right.

I would also try some Silk, especially if you are doing Black ones, 00 Silk is what I have my best results with for trim bands. I'd experiment. The Candy Apple Reds also come out very nice.

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 19, 2020 01:35PM

Trouble is the critical part of the rod for this wrap is the tip section. It's rare when any other section gets broken, and I haven't kept any broken tips to experiment on. Nonetheless, your replies do not discourage me from trying a dab of superglue - no red flags - so I'm going to give it a try. I think I'll use the tip of a bodkin to apply a smidgen of superglue. I'll stick to NCP. Thanks for your input.

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: ben belote (---.zoominternet.net)
Date: May 19, 2020 03:52PM

Phil, maybe just a drop of CP will hold it..

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Herb Ladenheim (---.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net)
Date: May 19, 2020 05:24PM

Why not just tape your trim-band thread along blank - partially wrap feet over the taped trim - pull trim under the guide wrap?
Herb

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 19, 2020 06:52PM

Herb - I plan to use at most only three turns of thread for the trim wrap. I fear when I trim the ends off slack will develop in what is basically a two or three turn whip finish. In my experience slack will develop in the 2 or 3 decorative wraps the moment the whip finish ends are trimmed, no matter how cautious I am - especially using metallic thread.

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: May 20, 2020 07:30AM

Phil,
This method may be unconventional, but it works very very well for trim bands.

Before getting to the trim band, lay in a trim thread on your current wrap. Also, lay in a pull thread on your current wrap.

Then, at the end of your wrap, execute your two or three turn thread wrap and pull the end of the loose end of the trim band, back under your existing wrap. Cut the free ends, burnish and you are good for thread finish. If you do the trim bands, with the free ends under about 5 existing wraps, you never have to worry about a free tag end coming loose.

This is the method that I have used for years, when executing a very narrow trim band, because I dislike any tag ends coming loose.

Take care

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 20, 2020 08:24AM

This sounds like an elegant solution to the problem. Using this method have you experienced any problems with separation or "flyaway" by the strands of shiny floss on metallic thread when the tag end of the trim wrap is pulled under the completed (taut) main wrap?

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Bob Ginther (162.245.179.---)
Date: May 20, 2020 09:09AM

I am not an experienced rod builder but I will throw in my limited experience with trim bands. I started out using the method Tom Kirkman showed in his videos. I was having difficulty with them coming unwrapped before I got the epoxy on (again, I am inexperienced). So I switched to a method similar to what Roger and Herb recommended - using a pull thread to pull the trim band tag ends under the guide wrap. This definitely solved the problem of them coming loose, although it did add a couple extra steps to the Kirkman method. However, I was using regular nylon for guide wraps and metallic for the trim band. I did not use any color preserver on the guide wraps. So when I applied the epoxy to the guide wrap and trim band, the regular nylon of course went translucent, thereby exposing the metallic trim band tag ends that I had pulled under the guide wraps. That was not a look I was expecting nor do I like it. (I don't like seeing the guide feet either, for that matter...) So, just something to keep in mind if you are pulling tag ends under the guide wrap using regular nylon thread. I don't know if using color preserver would solve this issue.

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 20, 2020 09:34AM

Bob: Thanks for the "heads up"!

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: May 20, 2020 11:42AM

Phil,
Not if the tension on the main wraps is correct.

However, I have really done some wraps that have been a big on the tight side, and then there is a possibility that it is next to impossible to even do a pull through with a metallic thread. If I find that this has happened, I will take the time to go back and do a rewrap with a touch looser wrapping tension.


Take care

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Re: adhesive compatibility
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 21, 2020 08:42AM

Roger,
I have spent so much time taking care to create tight wraps I'm not at all comfortable deliberately making looser wraps!

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