I am following up on another post that speaks of line twist.
I had expressed my frustration with any method to fill a spinning reel spool in a way to avoid a quick introduction of line twist to the line.

As I said in my reply, I have only found one method to give me suitable results. i.e. to have the line laid out in water and then while in the boat, reel the line back onto the spool using the reel to reel it in and then the line remains untwisted for an extended period of time.

---------------
I just now realized that I have seen this phenomena before. But having seen this does not mean that it transforms easily into a machine to properly load a spinning reel.

But for the example.

Take a 100 foot extension cord and pull it all out so the cord is laying perfectly flat on the ground. Then, at the far end - tie a long ribbon to the cord so that you can see what the end of the cord is doing. Then stand sideways to the line and pull in the extension cord and coil it into your hand - without doing any line manipulation or changing. You are essentially duplicating what is happening to your spinning line every time that you reel the line back in. I believe that you will see that when the line is coiled into your hand that you will find that the end of the line is spinning.

Now that you have a perfectly coiled line that was spooled straight onto your hand, have someone grab the end of the extension cord and have them walk away, holding tightly to the cord to not allow any twists to occur. For the person holding the extension cord, have them stand sideways so that the line spools off the side of the coil in a manner identical to what happens to a line coming off of a spinning reel. When you have the person get to the end of the line, have them lay the end of the cord on the ground. What happens to the cord? I believe that you will find that the cord erupts into a series of coils that were induced into the cord during the coiling process.

Assuming that that is the phenomena that does occur with an extension cord; then the exact same thing happens to your spinning line as it is wound on a line spool. i.e. if the line is loaded straight onto the line spool with no twists - when the line is case and the line peels off the side of the spool, the pealing of the line off the side of the spool is going to induce twists into the line that may or may not be resolved when the line is reeled back in.

If you doubt, give it a try and let us know what you find. If so, then this explains exactly why when a spinning reel is spooled onto a spinning reel, the line must be twisted in the correct direction, so that when the line is cast the twists come back out and do not present a problem. To verify the experiment, one would need to have line spooled straight onto another spool with the same diameter as the fishing line spool that is going to be filled. Then, when the new spools is to be filled, line is pulled off the side of the previously filled spool and the twists that are induced by pulling the line off of the spool will be dealt with when the same size spool puts the line back onto the side of the spool .

This also helps to explain why, if one fills a smaller fishing line spool from the side of a very large diameter filler spool that line twists occur fairly quickly on the spool being filled.

But, it also explains why, if one filled a fishing reel spool with a filler spool that is much closer in diameter to the line being filled that it takes much longer to have line twists to develop than was the case when filled from the larger diameter supply spool.

Time to get back to building. But, at the conclusion, I expect that if one fills a spool that is the same size as the spool on a spinning reel by spinning the spool and having it loaded from a filler spool and then using that same size spool to fill the new spinning reel by pulling the line off of the top or the bottom of the filler spool depending on line direction - that one would get a spool filled just right so that one would not have line twists develop very quickly.

Take care

So the thought process behind my post is that for a spinning reel to work long term without line twisting issues, is that the line needs to be loaded onto the reel with the correct amount of twists, so that in use, the twists come out on a cast and go back in during the reeling so that the line remains untwisted when the line is slack.

Take care

Be aware that due to the way that many fishermen tend to introduce twist when incorrectly spooling line, some line manufacturers had and have taken to "pre-twisting" the line on the sale spools in anticipation of the fisherman spooling his reel incorrectly, which in theory will then untwist the line as it is spooled. I've always thought this was a very bad idea, but many have and still do it this way.

............

Tom,
Read and understood.
But, from the theory of the line twist, the only correct way for a fisherman to load a spinning reel would be to load it from the side of an identically sized filler spool that had been loaded with 0 twists in it.

But from practical experience, most fishermen do not correctly orient the bulk spool to their reel spool when filling the reel. They cause it to twist, so the thinking by some line makers has been to pre-twist the line so that when the fisherman spools it incorrectly, he'll be untwisting it. Didn't say I thought it was prudent, but some have done it this way.

.............

When filling mono or fluorocarbon onto a spinning reel, I run the line through the guides tie it to the spool, and lay the filler spool flat on the floor. I make a few turn onto the reel and then I open the bail and pull some line off the reel. If I see line twists, I flip the filler spool upside down and continue to fill the reel spool. This effectively reduces line twists on the reel when loading fresh line. To prevent line twists during use, don’t try to reel line in against the drag, a sure way to introduce line twists. If using inline spinners a swivel helps prevent twists. I have not used mono or fluorocarbon as the main line for over 25 yrs. I find braid superior no matter the type of fishing I do, and I have very few, if any, problems with it twisting. I also close the bail by hand, this helps to prevent that annoying loop of line that may occur when the bail flips.
Norm

PS - if you have twists in your line, remove the lure and feed the line out of the boat while moving slowly. This will help remove any twists in your line. Just make sure there are no other boats in the area. You can also feed the line out into moving water to remove twists.
Norm

I never have needed all these complicated methods to avoid twist. Simply take the line off the feeder spool so that it comes off in an opposite direction from the way your reel bail turns. If your bail rotates clockwise when you observe it looking at the end of the spool, make the line come off the feeder spool counterclockwise. And vice versa.

It's what Norm is saying, but if you use reverse directions from the start, all will be well.

And if fishing causes twist, do as Norm's PS advises.

It's not that complicated!

Michael,
Line twist is not complicated.

For myself, I had just never stopped to figure out the exact reason why the twists occurred.

Take care

Set the bulk spool in a bucket up oh it's edges. While reeling line onto the reel watch the bulk spool rotate inside of bucket. No more twist. Saw this on you tube and it works.

Jeffrey,
Actually that method puts a lot of twist in the line.
The line is coming straight off the center of the spool in exactly the same way that it was put on the spool.
But, when the line goes onto the spinning reel, it goes onto the side of the spool, essentially like coiling up a rope.

On the other hand, if filling a casting reel, your method is 100% perfect.

Take care

I do the same, only on shore, go into the water and feed out my line and let the current straighten it.

What I do after spooling new line.... I take my rod and reel to our local school yard and tie on a large swivel and snap. Clip it onto a fence or post and walk out all of the line
and pre stretch it every fifty feet or so then back off the pressure on the line. the release of pressure will allow the coils to be removed at the swivel and after the line is returned
to the reel it will also be coil less and pre stressed.

I put line on my spinning reels the same way I put line on my casting reels. The only exception is that for spinning reels I have the line coming off the bottom of the spool, and for casting reels it comes off the top of the spool. This whole lay the the spool flat on the floor or make sure the line goes this way or that, has never worked for me.

I actually get less twist doing it the way I do it, than I would when I tried the other methods.I will say I only use Seaguar Tatsu fluorocarbon line on my my spinning reels, and it is level wound onto the spool. Perhaps that makes a difference? Either way, all that other stuff only complicates the matter.

And yep, like others have said, if you get twist in your line either let some out behind the boat and drag it (with nothing tied to its' end) for a few minutes. Or you can take it out in the yard let it out as you walk away and reel it back in. When I do it on land I pinch the line between my finger tips as I reel it back in. It pushes the twist towards the free end of the line, I've been doing everything the same way for years. It works great.

I have put hundreds of spools on spinning rods over the years by various methods. I have come to the conclusion that sometimes it will twist and sometimes it doesn't.

Steven Corvin Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have put hundreds of spools on spinning rods
> over the years by various methods. I have come to
> the conclusion that sometimes it will twist and
> sometimes it doesn't.


I've come to the same conclusion. I've found that using line conditioner, like KVD Line & Lure, helps a lot to where how you spool your line doesn't matter. After a few casts it's pretty straight and stays that way.

Roger,
I cannot thank you enough for starting this topic!!! Thank you also for those replying; Tom, Norman, Michael, Jeffery, Spencer, John, David and from the number of replies received so quickly thus far, thanks to those who have not replied yet for adding additional information. It is obviously a widespread and ongoing issue which some of you have apparently developed methods of re-spooling to eliminate the dreaded line-twist associated with spinning reels. While all of you have offered very good advice, I find Tom Ks to be the most profound, “…some line manufacturers had and have taken to “pre-twisting” the line on sales spools in anticipation of the fisherman spooling his reel incorrectly, which in theory will then untwist the line as it is spooled. I have always thought this was a bad idea”. I agree that it is a horrible idea!!!
Without giving it much thought and for over 40 years, I would re-spool my reels by simply inserting an axle of sort in the service spool which was clamped with the spool vertical in the bench vise using a rag to offer a bit of drag, ran the line through the butt guide and onto the spool and cranked away until the spool was filled. While fishing, line twist was present but not annoying or prohibitive and I always (and still do) allow(ed) the line to untwist after each retrieve before re-casting, even if for only the last 6-8ft of line.
Consulting the owner of the tackle store I have been using for 40 years, Bobby suggested re-spooling the way they always do to eliminate line-twist; direct spool-to-spool with the axles parallel; it certainly made sense and I figured all my line-twist issues would be a thing of the past. I disassembled a couple of old reels to salvage the spool-shafts so I could install an empty spool, chuck it up in a cordless drill, and re-spool the CORRECT WAY. Before our annual family trip to the Sierra, I re-spooled all of my and everyone else’s reels and told everyone of my re-spooling discovery. To my dismay, it did not solve line-twist issues and my daughter in particular was plagued with tight line twists jumping off her spool. I can only (now) assume the P-Line Floroclear was pre-twisted on the sales spool as suggested by Tom.
Norman mentioned observing that if the line was twisting while re-spooling, he would flip the service spool over and that may have corrected my scenario. I simply had the line coming off the top of the service spool and feeding onto the top of reel spool as well, thinking that would be the most logical.
If there is no manufacturer induced pre-twist, I would think the direction would not matter and the size difference of the service spool verses the reel spool should not matter as well. Please correct me if I am wrong.
Again, GREAT TOPIC AND EQUALLY GREAT REPLIES!!!!!!!!! I hope the responses keep pouring in.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!! BUILDING YOUR OWN SIMPLY ENHANCES THE EXPERIENCE.

I use a spooling tool that allows both axial and radial rotation of the spool. There are alot of Chinese knockoffs available on line of this Japanese tool. I believe Daiichi Seiko is the original, they make an excellent FG only took as well. Anyway I use the tool to spool all of my spinning feels, doesn't matter if it was twisted on the spool or not. The rotation of the bail arm and tension on the line allows the spool to free spin removing and preventing any line twist. Piscifun Fishing Line Winder is the most common knock off.

No doubt spinning the spool being filled and taking the line off a spinning feed spool (as in filling a baitcasting reel will not introduce twist , nor will it take it out. (I've never felt that I've purchased a spool of line that was pre-twisted). When I checked for videos on how to fill without introducing twist , the first one showed a guy using a lathe. Even more overkill. However, it is not the most efficient way of spooling a spin reel without introducing twist. So I don't do it.

Using the method that Norm and I mentioned I've never found that the new line needed any attention to eliminate twist, and I've seldom had a problem with twist introduced in the life of the line. But when I have, simple dragging it worked fine in eliminating it.

I think this is a case similar to many other methods in rodbuilding. There are many ways to skin a cat, and if you get used to using a method that is effective, and it's efficient for you, then there is no reason to change.

This video of a line filling machine results - i believe - in perfect line filling for both bait casters as well as spinning reels.

[www.amazon.com]]this&tag=vs-powersports-insert-amazon-20