Newbie question...is it absolutely necessary to use either tape or an arbor for reel seat base or can you just epoxy reel seat to blank if it is a close fit??

Rick,
Nothing is ever absolutely necessary.

However, when you glue a reel seat in place, it is nice to know that the rod blank runs down the center of the blank. If you do not have a mechanical lock and spacer on where the reel seat will be with respect to the blank, it is impossible to be absolutely sure that the reel seat will be parallel to the blank as well as being sure that the reel seat is centered exactly equally and symmetrical with respect to the blank. This then, is the need for a tape or arbor or other type of spacer to insure that the reel seat is positively locked into perfect alignment when it comes time for the glue to cure that is holding the reel seat tight to the blank.

But, you can absolutely build a rod however you wish to build the rod. You can use any components you wish and you can use any guides or threads or tip top to build the rod. The build is entirely in your hands and you may do what ever you please during the build of a particular rod.

Best wishes and enjoy the vocation of rod building.

Yea, what Roger said.

The arbor, be it tape, graphite, wood, or unicorn horn serves one purpose and one purpose only, to keep the blank perfectly centered inside the reel seat. The epoxy is what gives you gives you structural support and strength.

Case in point, I most often use drywall tape, which is the opposite of structural strength to arbor my seats.

If the fit it "close" you won't be able to use tape, etc., between the blank and seat. If the seat will slide onto the blank to the desired located without any "rattle" (a slip fit) then you don't need bushings or arbors. But if you do have space you should shim the seat with something.

..........

Close in this situation does not count. As Roger explained above, the seat alignment ought to be spot on correct.

While you may build a rod as you wish, you ought not deviate from accepted, proven practices until you understand why those accepted and proven practices are used.

Maybe I'm unlucky, but I do not remember ever having a blank and reel seat combination that did not require a bushing.

The arbor or drywall tape centers the blank in reel seat which makes it easier to install the fore and butt grips without having to do any special fitting.

You could install the reel seat without a bushing and if turns out not to your liking you chalk is up as lessons learned and go on from there.

The forum is a shared collection of experiences, some are familiar and some are new and the intent is to help us to make our craft a little easier.

Have fun

John

Your question is answered but if you use masking or drywall tape make sure you cover it completely with epoxy and on both ends to seal it from water. As Tom said there are some reel seats that will seat directly to the blank without an arbor. You would measure the blank where the seat will go (in mm) and use the appropriate size seat to fit snug in that position. The seat types that will fit like this are like the Fuji ACS and ECSM seats. 2 Piece reel seats like the SK series will have a snug fit that has to be measured and also will use an arbor for the nut barrel.

Rick.........you have been given some great information and advice. You did not mention if the reel seat was a casting or a spinning and that makes a difference and well. Your rod blank is tapered and a spinning reel seat is not. So one end is going to be closer to the bank than the other end and will require an arbor of of your choice. Some casting seats are made the same way and will require the same technique to install.

AS Lance Mentioned seat types like the Fuji ACS and ECSM are Casting seats and are tapered to fit the rod blank without an arbor. These reel seats are sized in 1/2 mm increments for an exact fit.

Tom

What type seat are we talking about?

For the drywall tape users... Have you had any problems with use? I recently used it on a rod but wasn’t confident using it for the reel seat so I only did the butt grip/butt cap. I thought it felt too soft for support, am I overthinking this? I like the idea of using this tape because it’s wider and porous but it seems too soft and I kept thinking it wouldn’t give a solid support structure even when glued.

Michael,
For myself, I personally dislike the use of drywall tape.
However, for those folks that do use it - the use of tape along with epoxy is a very good choice. The epoxy fills the gaps and makes it a pretty bullet proof installation.

For the grips that I don't use an arbor, I would rather use masking tape. In between each row of tape forming the arbor, I leave a narrow gap. Then, when the grip is glued up, or the reel seat is glued up as the case may be, I insure that the gaps are filled with epoxy which encapsulates the tape and makes for a permanent installation.

For reel seats, the seats that have come out in recent years, with internal conforming arbors work very well.

Best wishes

In my opinion, dry wall tape is one of the best ways to securely shim a reel seat or a loose fitting grip, but you have to know how to use it. To prevent the tape from ‘walking’ after applying epoxy, I tack the leading edge to the blank with super glue. Tightly wrap on the drywall tape until you get a tight fit. When you get a good fit unwrap the tape until you see the blank underneath the tape and then start adding the epoxy while you tightly rewrap the tape. This forces the epoxy into the mesh and creates a strong bond between the blank and what ever you want to shim. I have never had a drywall mesh shim fail. Drywall tape is lighter and cheaper than masking tape and, in my opinion, gives a more secure bond. In most, cases you only need a few wraps of drywall tape to get the job done. For larger gaps between the reel seat and the blank, I like to use the polyurethane foam arbors, which I glue into the reel seat prior to installing on the blank. Once the epoxy has cured it’s a simple matter of just reaming the reel seat to fit. When I get my reel seats, one the first thing I do is to glue the foam arbors in place for later use. Also, if you over ream a handle, a layer of drywall tape will insure a snug fit.
I also use drywall tape when retrofitting new grips on a rod. Basically, you drill out the new handle until it just fits over the butt of the blank and will slide on the blank. I use a wrap or two of drywall tape to get a good snug fit, then glue the rear grip into place.
There are different ways to do the same thing, I don’t like using masking tape, but many others do. Use whatever method works best for you.
Norm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/01/2020 10:46AM by Norman Miller.

Close = no space for anything added while still retaining a slip fit. It's rare, but it happens. If you don't have a slip fit you may just be scraping the epoxy off when you join the parts.

The term "slip fit" can have many meaning to many different people. Those of us who have been doing this for a while know what it means. But when teaching classes my students have no idea what it means and the way I explain it to them is that the reel seat (or handle) should slide in place using minimal force and not "wiggle" when you try to move the blank back an forth in the seat or handle. To me its more of a feel thing and once its correct to me I let my students feel what it feels like whan putting it in place. Trying to explain it in words on a forum is a real challenge.

Basically to me a slip fit is when they slide together with minimal force and will not move in any direction except up and down. Some things that have slip fit, the rear view mirror in your car is a ball and socket, but it is a slip fit. When you adjust the mirror it moves fairly easily but there is no side to side movement. If you have an inkjet printer, the printer head moves along a bar and the two components have a slip fit, otherwise your print would not look very good, horizontal movement is all that is possible.

Maybe someone else can explain it better.

Hope that helps a little.

[reelseats.com] Here is what I use to secure the real seat to the blank. I have never had a problem with these urethane bushings. Rec one of our sponsors carries them. Bill