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Guide selection
Posted by: Brett Mahoney (---)
Date: November 22, 2019 08:09PM

I am building a 7'3" spinning rod that will be used for general nearshore fishing (bull reds, Snook, Cobia, Jacks) matched up with a 5000-6000 (Shimano) size reel. Right Now the blank I am most likely going with is a rod geeks XC732 (15-25lb). I plan on the rod having 8 guides all fuji K series Double foot. My question comes into play when choosing the size of the guides, after thinking about it and looking at some rods I already have I decided on starting with a 30 and tapering down to 8s. How ever I was talking to someone who recommended I start with a 25 instead stating that with braided line you don't have to work as hard to coral the line so the guide can be smaller and the basic rule of thumb being the first guide to be half the diameter of the spool. After doing some research I found the reels I was planning on using met that criteria. My issue is when looking at rods I already have I have size 25 guides on rods matched up to 2500-3000 size reels so it seems a little small for this rod.

I just want a few options before ordering all my parts. What would you recommend?

Edit: I just measured a rod I use with 8000-10000 reels and the first guide is a 30, seems like my application falls right between the two sizes



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/22/2019 08:10PM by Brett Mahoney.

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: herb canter (---.atmc.net)
Date: November 22, 2019 08:54PM

For a 5000-6000 size Shimano spinner and braid 30 - 40 pounds or under a size 30 ring is indeed grossly over sized , i have a 10,000 size Shimano spinner with a 76 mm spool diameter on my 11 foot surf rods and it performs incredible with a size 20 mm ring with a 25 size ring being the largest i would ever consider . I have tried a KW 30 on it but it did nothing but add weight and allow the line to move too much inside the ring, ( Energy loss) instead of being contained and directed forward . A major factor in building the most efficient setup possible is to figure out what size rings will provide the best possible performance while avoiding efficiency loss which happens when ring sizes are larger than absolutely necessary. .This applies to the reduction train, choke guide and runners .

It takes a lot of testing and retesting to figure that out and i'll admit most don't go to those extremes they usually just choose ring sizes that they know will work and will leave it at that.


Forget about the first ring should be half the diameter of the spool especially when braid is your line of choice , it's completely different . Now if using mono i would choose a 30 size ring to start the reduction train because that would be the right choice with a 6000 size Shimano , Shimano's spinners DO NOT throw large coils for a variety of reasons but spool shape and spool lip design is one of the main reasons as is oscillation systems they use and continue to use on their reels.

When using braid i use size 5 runners even on my surf rods , is there a reason you're thinking of using size 8 rings for runners on a rod that will be targeting red's snook and Jacks etc ? Do you plan to use heavy leaders with knots that require that large an opening ?

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: Brett Mahoney (---)
Date: November 22, 2019 09:39PM

I plan on using size 8 because I will be using heavier leaders tied directly into the braid that will need to be able to pass through the guides. I know I can go smaller for the runners and unitize an FG knot but I find most people use a uni to uni and don't want someone to be able to use the rod because they don't know a knot.

I do agree a lot with what your are saying but every time I start leaning one way I consider the alternative. I imagine I would be pleased with both outcome just trying properly weigh the options.

Using what you know what guide sizes would you recommend for the entire guide train?

Thanks

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: November 22, 2019 10:15PM

You know, the line path will tell you what sizes you need and where they need to be located.

................

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: Brett Mahoney (---)
Date: November 22, 2019 10:36PM

I understand there are ways to find this figure things out but I do not have the blank or the reel available to me at this time. With the endless amount of information that can be found through the internet and amount of people willing to share their experiences there is a lot to learn. I just want to exhaust every option learning as much as possible along the way. Once I do have all the pieces I will verify that they will work but just want to get a head start and take any bit of information someone else is willing to share along the way.

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: herb canter (---.atmc.net)
Date: November 23, 2019 12:03AM

Tom Kirkman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You know, the line path will tell you what sizes
> you need and where they need to be located.
>
> ................



Line path is how i determine the proper height of guides but not ring sizes , the spinning reel specs and line characteristics is how i determine the best possible ring sizes because i build rods for only a single reel and line type . I never change reels and lines they're all purposely built for that one specific setup . If i had a habit of swapping out different reels and lines than i would just choose guides that will work with a wide variety of reel's and lines .

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: Spencer Phipps (---)
Date: November 23, 2019 11:03AM

My rods running braid with your small reels are running 10 to 20 mm depending if they have a chance of seeing mono also and their application.

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---)
Date: November 23, 2019 12:15PM

"nearshore" fishing suggests you will be fishing from a boat. Any guide size will be fine if you stick to trolling, and most any spin-rod guide configuration will support 50-yard casts - plenty long enough for 98% of inshore work. Inshore boats are usually of modest size and get bounced around a lot. I would go with the strongest, most damage resistant guides.

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Re: Guide selection
Posted by: Ken Brown 2 (---.229.194.3.res-cmts.sm.ptd.net)
Date: November 25, 2019 07:48AM

If you are using braid, I would say anything over a 25 for the first guide is too much. If you are using mono, you may go up to a 40 if you are using a beefy spinning reel. Like Tom stated above, I normally do a build with a reel in mind and usually don't change out the reels so my setup is very specific. If I was to build a 'general purpose' rod, then I would go with the strongest and biggest guides available.

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