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Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Eric Oertle (---.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net)
Date: February 07, 2019 02:40PM

I'll be turning 70 in a few weeks and have arthritis in my hands that can be extremely painful at times.

I built my first rod back in the early '70s and took a long hiatus before getting back into it a couple years ago. I only did basic builds until a few months ago when I did my first butt wrap. I've done several since, building decorative rods for family and friends and other than my hand issues I'm thoroughly enjoying it.

My first build was done with the rod on my lap and books on the floor to tension the thread. Later I used notched cardboard and currently use a wooden hand wrapper.

I've been looking at power wrappers mainly for long under wraps which take their toll on me. Not looking to spend a ton of money, but have yet to find one that has all the features I would really like.

I like the thread setup on the RBS and the fact that you can go at it from either side but was hoping to have one with roller stands and a reversible variable speed motor? Is there anything out there I'm not finding that might fit my needs? Should stay in the under $400 range to keep from getting a divorce lol

Eric Oertle
Old enough to know better - but crazy enough to try anyway

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Mark Talmo (71.147.59.---)
Date: February 07, 2019 08:00PM

Eric,
I sympathize with your arthritic issues as, I too, suffer from such. After my fingers get warmed-up though, constant movement such as rod building affords relief; it’s the initial movement after being idle for a while that is the toughest for me.
A power wrapper may just the ticket for you. Hopefully Roger W. will offer his veteran suggestions as he has built many wrappers and dryers over many years.
I understand and agree that adjustable roller uprights are certainly nicer than felt covered Vs but you might be hard-pressed to find such a system, new anyway, for under $400.00. Consider that the curing/drying cabinet I built uses felt covered Vs and they have never scratched or marred the surface of a rod, if that is your concern. However, the power wrapper I built employs O-ring covered roller uprights (4 of them, 3 rollers each) to securely hold rods while wrapping. But I have over $600.00 invested in material alone and, to be honest, the headstock is not as stout as the CRB unit you showed because I only do minor grip-shaping with my unit. In addition to the headstock/motor/chuck, you will need some sort of uprights (a minimum of 3), a thread tray, and an appropriate base to connect all of them. One feature many overlook is the ability to move the thread tray the full length of the base without having to move or remove the uprights. I consider that to be more of a necessity than simply a convenience.
Beside the above mentioned issues, there are others for you to consider before you purchase or build a power wrapper including;
1.) Wrapping direction; turning toward you with the thread coming from above and behind or turning away from you with the thread coming from below and in front of you. It seems the majority of builders prefer the former but I have found doing more intricate wraps such as vine leafs much easier and efficiently with the latter. It is certainly a personal preference. Obviously, a unit that can be adapted either way is a plus.
2.) Motor power/direction and headstock precision; more power/precision if planning to turn grips, less power/ precision required if used solely for power wrapping. One way or the other, the ability to reverse the motor is another necessity rather than a convenience.
3.) Motor speed control; another necessity rather than convenience. The speed control unit I integrated in my system was cheap in cost but ended up being in quality as well, is marginal at best and is difficult to accurately adjust. A quality speed controller will save a lot of aggravation.
4.) Chuck; the quality depends on how you plan on using it! For turning grips, an upgraded three-jaw is certainly wise. If simply used to hold the rod while wrapping or minor shaping, the common, adjustable slip-chuck is all that is required. That’s all I have needed. A slip-clutch can be adjusted to afford the desired resistance while thread wrapping, loosened-up for thread finishing, or tightened-up for minor shaping. Relatively inexpensive yet very effective gizmos.
5.) Base; while the base obviously needs to be long enough for the intended length of rods to be made, space requirements may dictate it not being any longer than necessary. Make certain extensions are available though, just in case you end up building that 14ft surf rod. My base is constructed of 1 X 3 Tee-slot aluminum extrusions, two 6ft and one 3ft sections.
While hopefully this helps to direct you in the right direction, hopefully others will add their input as well, Roger in particular. Additionally, there might be someone out there who has an appropriate used power wrapper for sale.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!!

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Eric Oertle (---.lightspeed.prsdwi.sbcglobal.net)
Date: February 07, 2019 08:34PM

Thank you for your response Mark.

1) I have only had experience with the latter and think it would be clumsy for me to have the spools on my side. I do enjoy doing inlaid and wound threads and will be doing some olive leafs etc.

2) Totally agree

3) Had not considered speed control, but would be wonderful to have. I do think that could be added on the motor base eventually.

4) Was not planning on turning grips, but think I could make a rig for that easily enough using a very low speed drill I own that can go from 25 - 500 RPM with lathe type torque. I turn and form brass on it now

5) That was another feature I liked with the CRB unit. The rods I build are either max 7ft or 2-piece

Again, Thank you

Eric Oertle
Old enough to know better - but crazy enough to try anyway

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Mark Talmo (71.147.59.---)
Date: February 07, 2019 11:13PM

Eric,
The thread spools/ tensioners are under and slightly behind the rod axis on my wrapper = out of the way. The thread is directed though small eyelets to the front of the thread tray. If you care to do so, please see pics under “Photos”, “Equipment and Tools”, Mark’s Wrapper”.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!!

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Eric Oertle (---.lightspeed.prsdwi.sbcglobal.net)
Date: February 07, 2019 11:30PM

Looks like a beautiful setup Mark. Now I'm jealous lol

Eric Oertle
Old enough to know better - but crazy enough to try anyway

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: roger wilson (---.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
Date: February 07, 2019 11:31PM

Eric,
If you are handy, and have the tools you can make your own power wrapper. The cost will be dependent on what you put into it.

For example a couple of pictures:

[www.rodbuilding.org]

The power head that I use for my current wrapper. This head stock uses a 1/2 inch keyless chuck that rotates on a pair of 1/2 inch bearings pressed into a nylon block. It is driven by XL timing gears and belt by a dc gear motor. If holding a rod with no butt cap, I will use a tapered piece of solid stock up the butt of the rod to hold the rod for work.

If wrapping a rod with a finished butt section, I use a Taig 3 inch chuck with aluminum jaws mounted on a 1/2 to 3/4x16 adapter shank.

--------------------
The current bed for my power wrapper made from a piece of aluminum channel with rollers on the bottom to let the bed roll up and down the rod bench for easy wrapping without moving.
[www.rodbuilding.org]

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These are the rod rests that I use to support the rod while wrapping>
[www.rodbuilding.org]

----------------------
Then, I have a control box / power supply and foot pedal to supply power and control to the motor on the power head.

If you have more questions, on how to do something, just drop me a line and I will see if I can answer your questions: hflier@comcast.net


Take care

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Nicholas Riccardi (97.96.45.---)
Date: February 08, 2019 10:29AM

I too have arthritis in my hands at 90, and was looking for the best way to go, I wonder if Roger would give us his expertise on the Alps with the up graded chuck, as a beginner I thought it looked good.

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: roger wilson (---.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
Date: February 08, 2019 10:42AM

Nicholas,
Yes of course.
The Alps wrapper with the upgraded chuck is excellent.

The up graded chuck on the alps wrapper is essentially the Taig head stock with the Taig chuck. Both of these products have been used for many years in the lathe industry and both are proven products.

Good luck

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Dan Ertz (---.dsl.airstreamcomm.net)
Date: February 08, 2019 10:51AM

Something that may be helpful for arthritic hands is wearing latex gloves when hand wrapping rods. VERY grippy so you don't have to squeeze the blank as hard when turning it.

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Eric Oertle (---.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net)
Date: February 08, 2019 11:36AM

I'm really appreciating the feedback guys.

What is the difference between the Alps and the American/PacBay? They both look the same.

Can a reverse circuit be added to either of them?

I don't like the idea of having the carriage between me and the rod, but think I could make my own assembly to fix that.

Eric Oertle
Old enough to know better - but crazy enough to try anyway

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Eric Oertle (---.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net)
Date: February 08, 2019 11:39AM

roger wilson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Eric,
> If you are handy, and have the tools you can make
> your own power wrapper. The cost will be
> dependent on what you put into it.

I've built many things over the years, some very intricate - just not ready for another big project. At this point in my life I'd rather start with someone elses base unit and modify as necessary.

Eric Oertle
Old enough to know better - but crazy enough to try anyway

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Re: Basic Power Wrapper?
Posted by: Norman Miller (---.lightspeed.jcsnms.sbcglobal.net)
Date: February 08, 2019 12:02PM

I’m not an electrical engineer, but from what I understand the only way to get a reversible motor is to use a DC motor. You can switch polarity by flipping a switch, can’t do this with AC motors. Roger set me up with a reversible DC motor, control box ,and foot pedal for my Renzetti rod lathe. I have much more control with the new motor and foot pedal than I did with the motor and foot pedal supplied by Renzetti. Still learning how to use a power wrapper. Wrapped by hand all my life, so power wrapping is still outside of my comfort zone.
Norm

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