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Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 05:22AM

Ok, so im doing a restoration on a cabelas rod.. Now before you guys start going off about just buying a new blank and skipping all this work, epecially since its not a very expensive rod, (atleast i assume it isnt, there isnt a model number) im doing it. It was my grandfathers... (for all who know my posts, its a diffrent rod then discussed in previous post)

It is a Cabelas Fish Eagle Graphite Walleye 6'6".. But doing research, the logo is from 70s-80s, im in the process of getting approval from cabelas, (or bass pro shops now) to use thier logo for restoration purposes.. Im probably going to have to go with thier current logo, instead of the 70s-80s logo.. Im fine with that.. After a week of researching, i just want an approval letter.. Decalconnection.com has already basically rendered the new decal, just need the approval yet.. So while i waited on that, figured i would pick your guys brains for a little..

Ill start with the decal, the thread epoxy looks like leather, small cracks, almost looks like a mosaic.. I can peel failry decent chunks off without heat, and only my fingernail.. With that in mind, the thread coat is yellowed so much its basically brown.. The thread below the epoxy looked like it was a very dark forrest green, its acaully a kind of clover color green.. The decal has gold leafing.. Needless to say in trying to save the decal by carfully peeling, while applyng little amounts of heat, didnt work.. the gold leafing is completly fused to the epoxy.. And pulling the decal writing off... So some form of reproduction decal has to happen.. Or i have to steady my hand and write it out manually..

The original blank coating has about 50% chipped off, im removing it with plastic tooling to not damage the blank.. Works amazingly well so far.. Granted i have a far way to go yet..

The guides glow in the dark... Is there a way to bring the "glow" back to the guides? My UV light gets a glow for about 5 seconds before it dulls to nothing again..

There is a double foot stripper guide, and the rest are single foot.. The tip top looks to be original (still has the glow guide) but the thread wraps at the tip top look like a stream side fix with black thread.. I havent removed the guides or tip top yet, really hoping i dont run into a problem at the tip..

The cork is to no surprise shot.. Its a handle assembly i havent done before, but it shouldnt be that hard to replicate.... Its full grip, tapered to the middle. From both ends, with the downlocking ring hidden in the butt, then 2" of cork cut out with a flat spot to accomidate the reel handle, followed by 2" of threads with the other ring floating and 2 locking rings.. Im going to do everything in my power to reuse the hardware, but Im probably going to have to search for all new hardware, it seems like everything is graphite anymore.. Then a tapered fore grip... It has a 1" hard rubber butt cap as well.. If i take my time, choose components carfully im confident i can reproduce it.. If i run into a snag there, i might ask one of you guys with a lathe, and alot more experience to help me out..

After removing the guides, and as much of the flaking finish as i can get, im planning on wet sanding the blank starting with 100 and working my way up to 2000 grit.. Ill be taking my time with this part, i tend to have a heavy hand.. I planned on wiping to blank down with denatured alcohol, allowing the blank to dry fully before wiping multiple times until the cloth is completly residue free.. Unless you guys can suggest a better cleaner lr solvent?

Now i think im going to go with spar urethane.. Either use a sponge brush, or figure out a way to apply thin coats with some sort of squeegee system.. Suggestions for applying, or suggestions on what type of finish to use instead are welcome.. Im verry new to this, and really dont want to screw this one up.. Im going to hang the rod between coats with the tip aiming up(?) To allow any excess to run to the butt and drip, or would it be better to put in my rod dryer? Its only 9 rpm..

should i scuff the coating before applications? Or just apply coats without scuffing? Is it ok to urathane over the trim wraps and decal? Or best to wait until the blank has a completed final coat before reapplying the decal and trim.. Speaking of final coats... Should i apply anything to protect the spar urethane as a final coat? Im far from used to working with urethanes as you guys can probably tell..

Im not going to rewrap the guides in static placment, that would defeat the idea of a restoration in my eyes.. I meticulously measured everything to the 64th of an inch with my caliper, (or closer) so everything should go back on accuratly...

I think i covered everything... Any suggestions? Something i missed? Better products? Etc.?

It may not be an expensive rod.. But it has incredible sentimental value, and i know my grandfather is looking down at me smiling already...

As always, the wealth of knowledge you guys bring to the table is priceless in my eyes... So thank you all in advance for your advice/suggestions/corrections.

-Anthony

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Matthew Paul (---.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 06:55AM

for the seat chip off the cork and heat it with a heat gun a little bit at a time as to not get it to hot checking if it is loosening the epoxy back then broke down easily with heat applied and you should be able to save the old seat components and clean them up and reuse them as they are original to the rod.
As for the rest I will let the other Einstein's tell you how do do the rest as some of my ways are to old school for them

The best day to be alive is always tomorrow !!
Think out side the box when all else fails !!!
Wi.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2018 06:57AM by Matthew Paul.

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: October 12, 2018 10:06AM

Anthony,
Your way will work.

However, you might consider something else.

You have all of the measurements on the blank. You can take close up pictures of all of the lettering.

Having that, I would cut off the guides, cut off the cork, and take new cork and turn it to the exact shape and size as the current grip. Then, I assume that this is a rod for display only - I would then sand down the blank to be free of everything.

Then, repaint the blank in the perfect matching color, rewrap the guides in the perfect matching thread and redo the decals and lettering as required.

But, as always, it is your choice.

Take care

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 12:05PM

The primary goal is for it to be a fuctional rod.. That may change once i get into it and see currently unforseen damage..

As for the cork.. Ive honestly never turned cork, i have the ability to do so.. My brother does have a 10" wood lathe at my disposal, but i have no idea how to setup a jig for turning.. And i cant currently afford to purchase one.. And when i say he has a lathe, i mean a 1936 lathe... Things a beast lol.. I only have a crb dryer 9 rpm.. Im hoping for a power wrapper for christmas.. But that will probably just remain a hope.. Lol

I guess i could always do it old school and just hone it by hand.. I have no idea where to start when buying cork rings.. Im sure its as simple as it looks, but isnt there diffrent thicknesses, qualities, diameters, inside diameters, etc? Is it better to buy specific grade cork from the same lots? Like you should do when purchasing wood to ensure color and quality control? Is it even sold in lots? Do i over complicate things? Was that a mermaid i had on my line last night? Do i ask to many questions?

As for saving the reel seat, i plan to do the very best i can, as with any restoration using as many of the original parts is always a prefered choice..

Thanks for the replies guys

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: October 12, 2018 05:10PM

Anthony,
You don't have to buy cork rings and you don't have to buy a lathe. You can buy the correct cork grip and simply slip it onto the rod and glue it up. You may have to do a bit of searching but there are many many different finished grips on the market.

Best wishes.

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---)
Date: October 12, 2018 05:16PM

Ive looked.. That was my plan originally.. But coumd only find a foregrip that matched fairly close..

Then again for the rear grip i coukd always just get a Straight no taper premade grip and shape it by hand.. It would take time.. But would probably work



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 10/12/2018 05:18PM by Anthony Unger.

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Matthew Paul (---.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 06:43PM

got to this page [www.anglersworkshop.com] and there are several different configurations of pre shaped rear grips and fore grips you should be able to find something close or a match and a rubber buttcap to fit when you order it you can make it fit buy reaming it out a bit or filling the gap buy spacing a series of small build up arbors with masking tape and then just use rod builders epoxy to glue them up the building glue is totally different from finish epoxy the same for replacing the reel seat you can buy a arbor or make 3 -4 tape arbors and dry fit all the handle parts so you know everything is how it should be no need to buy rings and turn the grips I would try using Denatured alcohol to remove the finish on the blank try a small test spot .
attaching the butt cap I use gorilla brown glue and only apply it to water dampened cork and scuff the inside of the cap and push it on and immediately wipe off the squeeze out it will be there and not pop off.
now maybe one of the Einstein's will chime in with more suggestions to help you out .

The best day to be alive is always tomorrow !!
Think out side the box when all else fails !!!
Wi.

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Phil Erickson (---.dsl.pltn13.sbcglobal.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 06:58PM

My suggestion, is Perma Gloss instead of urethane. No yellowing and far less added weight.

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 07:05PM

I was contemplating perma gloss.. Ive never use it.. But have read some people haveing trouble using it.. Usually everyone says "theres a learning curve with it," that kinda worries me... I dont have a spare blank to test on... I do like the idea of lighter.. With the apparent learning curve, Is perma gloss a better choice?

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: roger wilson (---.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 07:09PM

Anthony,
Go to a charity box at a sporting goods store or good will and buy a couple of rods for a dollar or two to use as test blanks. Also, you will now have some blank material if you need to use for patching or other work.

Good luck

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 07:22PM

Thats a really good idea.. My wife is acually going to a flea market/yard sale thingy im 2 weeks.. Looks like she has a job to do.. I dont know why i never thought to do that.. Its amazing when theres an answer right in front of your nose.. Im not expecting this build to be done in a weekend.. @#$%&, i still cant get permission for useing the logo.. And i dont want to remove anything i dont have a replacement for, or atleast something i know i cant readily get..

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Norman Miller (---)
Date: October 12, 2018 07:36PM

Permagloss is one of the best choices for clear coating a rod. Do a search here, there are a lot of posts on how to do it. Very easy to apply to a naked blank and gives great results. There also are a lot of posts concerned with refrubishing and restoring old rods. It is not that difficult to do just go slow and easy, and don’t use 100 grit paper. I usually scrape the old finish off with a blade held 90 degrees to the blank. After scraping, I wet sand with 500 to 2000 grit, almost like polishing the blank.
The guides with the fluorescent shock rings are probabaly old discontinued Fuji aluminum oxide guides. PacBay still sells a double ft lookalike [www.mudhole.com] . Many of the Cabelas rods from that time frame were made by GLoomis. The Cabelas brothers helped bankroll GLoomis business, and he sold them blanks in return for their help.
Norm

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 07:46PM

Oh i know about the many many inquires about using perma gloss.. Ive seen them...

Really? G loomis? Thats really cool.. I didnt know that.. See thats why i like this site... Always learn something new

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Lynn Behler (---.97.252.156.res-cmts.leh.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 08:23PM

Anthony, we should talk.

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 08:26PM

When ever you would like to im game :)

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Lynn Behler (---.97.252.156.res-cmts.leh.ptd.net)
Date: October 12, 2018 08:42PM

Check your E-mail

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Mark Talmo (---)
Date: October 13, 2018 12:49AM

Anthony,
You have received numerous qualified and caring replies from veteran rod builders. Acknowledge and apply their suggestions and you will surprise yourself while pleasing your Grandfather how nice the final product turns out. Just take your time!
All of the veterans responding to your post also responded to my newbie posts dating back three years. All of them helped to flatten my learning curve enormously! Rare would be the case I would disagree with any of their knowledge or views. After reading your posts and subsequent replies, allow me to offer my input to your heirloom restoration.
1.) Blow out the 100 grit sandpaper. Do not use anything below 320, again, take your time. Final sanding with finer than 1000 does not afford the finish to be applied a really good bite to the blank. I find it better to final sand with 600 or less and apply at least two coats of rod finish which will fill in any sanding marks.
2.) Go with PermaGloss or similar to finish the blank. The only thing better is spraying a quality, high dollar, modern-day automotive clear coat which is not practical or cost effective. Rather, punch a hole in a fine-cell cosmetic pad approximately 50-75% the diameter of the butt of the rod. Saturate the pad with PG. Starting at the tip, slightly squeeze and tilt the pad 30*-45* with the bottom pointed toward the direction of travel, producing a small pool of finish in front of the pad as you slowly drag the pad across the blank (about 10 seconds for a 7ft blank). Immediately reverse the direction and slowly drag the pad down and off the blank. The puddle in front of the pad insures an adequate amount of finish to be applied to the blank and the squeezed and tilted foam pad squeegees the finish uniformly. Yes, learned technique may produce the best results, but even performing this technique for the first time will produce favorable results. By the way, I learned about punching the hole in the pad on this site, but cannot remember whom to acknowledge, but thank you so much. It really works!!!
3.) As for your thread color or cork issues, I am not comfortable with my qualifications to answer.

Mark Talmo
FISHING IS NOT AN ESCAPE FROM LIFE BUT RATHER A DEEPER IMMERSION INTO IT!!!

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 13, 2018 02:52AM

As ive said before, the wealth of knowledge is staggering in my opinion.. Its a sad day when a hobby, or trade, becomes nearly extinct due to kept secrets.. As i like to say, your only as good as the information given.. I hope no one thinks my questioning is to conflict with valid suggestions, its simply becouse i want to know as much as possible about something before jumping in.. I tend to over complicate simple tasks, (like the common cents system)

That is an excellent suggestion by the way.. And thank you for a very discriptive explination.. As for the sanding, i probably wont go Below 600 honestly..



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 10/13/2018 03:42AM by Anthony Unger.

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Anthony Unger (---.15.236.249.res-cmts.ovr.ptd.net)
Date: October 14, 2018 12:28PM

lol hit a snag about 3 minutes into stripping the guides..

what is an acceptable paint to use on rod blanks? after permagloss, before prokote...
the trim bands are gold paint.. fooled me

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Re: Restoration project, any pointers from you pros?
Posted by: Norman Miller (---)
Date: October 14, 2018 01:53PM

Many rod producers used paint to make ‘faux’ trim wraps, this was a cheap way to go because it saved wrapping time. If I were you I would get rid if the paint and do a real thread trim wrap it looks better. If you insist on using paint then select a Testors enamel in the color you want and paint the area where you want it to show. You will need to use a NoCP thread or cp with regular thread to make sure the paint color does not show through the thread background after epoxying. Epoxy will not cause the enamel paint to bleed.
Norm

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