Hello again all,

Currently, when I put epoxy on guide wraps I use an alcohol touch to smooth out the finish and remove bubbles. I was thinking about getting a heat gun for this because it seems much easier and safer. I was wondering if anyone here used or uses a heat gun to thin out finish? If so do you have issues with dust getting in the epoxy? Very curious to thoughts on the matter. Thanks!

You are probably going to get a number of very different opinions on the subject of using heat on wraps! Mine is, "don't do it!"

I have never found the need to heat the wraps after applying the epoxy. If it is too thick, it has likely started to set up, and a fresh batch should be made, if there are bubbles, I blow on them with a straw which works great. However best to avoid bubbles best you can during mixing the epoxy.

However there are builders who do use heat in it's many forms and heat guns are one of them, and if you do, you surely would not want to use it in an area with dust particles that can be blown onto the fresh epoxy.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/17/2016 01:32PM by Phil Erickson.

Larry,
I have been using a heat gun for many years.
As with anything, there is a short learning curve to use just the right amount of heat and the distance from the wrap to achieve this distance. Typically, I use a couple of short passes about 4-6 inches from the wrap to slightly heat and then the finish when needed.

But, I also follow Phil's suggestion in using freshly mixed finish that has not set up much if at all.

But, any time there are a few or many bubbles in the finish the heat gun will quickly chase the bubbles out of the finish.

I use an industrial 1500 watt gun and has been my go to gun for years. I keep a piece of paneling on the floor to set the gun down when not using the gun. I have had the gun fall off of the table once, so ever since then, I only store the gun on the floor, so that the cord can not pull the gun off of the table and onto the floor. Also, the piece of paneling protect the floor from a hot gun if the gun happens to fall over. If it is on carpet, the gun will melt the carpet. If it is a floor of continuous flooring, it will also melt that. So protect the place where you place the gun to save the floor - even if the gun tips off its stand.

Good luck

p.s.
Before using the gun on each fresh batch, turn on the gun to full heat and direct the gun away from any finish or any rods for a few seconds. Now and then, there might be some dust or some sort of debris that might have gathered in the gun during storage. So, by blowing the gun out before use each time with the heat on - you will avoid blowing any dust or debris onto the rod or its finish.

While I can understand a few seconds of gentle heat from a butane lighter or similar to remove bubbles, I cannot understand why epoxy needs heating to "smooth it out."

Rodbuilders continue to have trouble with epoxy because they try to do too much; they do all sorts of things that simply aren't necessary. Epoxy is just so terribly easy to apply and get perfect results with, I can't fathom bothering with all of the things so many people do to it. At the seminar I gave at the recent Expo on epoxy finishing, I wanted to illustrate how easy it really is, so I went in and purposely tried to ruin the finish with some oddball stuff. I failed - it came out perfect.

Do less and get better results.

.................

I will try to do less. I also think part of the problem I am having comes from where I make my rods, which is my basement. It's a steady 65 ° f down there so maybe the cold causes it to thicken quicker? Unless I am just over thinking it again. I just thought I would ask around for input. Personally the best results I have gotten so far are from putting some epoxy on and heating it to get all the excess off, leaving a pretty smooth finish. I mainly have issue with the larger expoxy areas like covering a decal. I plan on coating some new carbon fiber grips I got and am trying to get an idea of how I want to finish them as clean as possible.

Heat changes the viscosity of the finish, and if you have the need to change the viscosity then you always have that option. It will hasten polymerization, speed the absorption into the threads, and remove air bubbles (keep in mind with a good mix these things will happen on their own pretty easily anyway). Nevertheless, you will always hear about using caution with heat, whether it be from a lighter, wick, or gun. These are usually for good reason, as your rod blank is also made up of materials that are bound by resin. Heat can break apart this resin, and even if you don't see or feel the degradation of the rod blank it may still occur after a certain degree. Still, you'll find successful rod builders who use heat often and freely, and some who wouldn't dare.

In the beginning I used to experiment with lighters, torches, heat guns ... Now I follow the 'keep it simple' rule and the results are much better. I don't use any direct heat, but I do apply finish on my custom built drying station which has heat lamps positioned above the rod (given that I work in my basement were temperatures are very low in Winter). Other than that, I just use a mechanical mixer to reduce bubbles during mixing, and also the straw to remove bubbles from the tray before I apply, and also from the wrap itself after I apply ... straw is simple and works great!

Larry

There are very accomplished builders who use heat. But if you observe or listen to them closely, their use of heat is quick and gentle, and their use of heat has been honed over many rods and years.

There are, however, alternatives that are as effective with the added benefit of fewer to no downside risks. You wrote that you use heat to smooth the finish and remove bubbles, and you subsequently wrote that your main problem was to remove excess epoxy from longer areas such as a decal and that your work area is 65 degrees. So, here are some options other than a heat gun, alcohol lamp, etc.:
(1) raise the room temperature to at least 70 degrees. You would not think a couple degrees below 70 would be a big deal, but it is for epoxy.
(2) don't apply so much epoxy you have to use heat to remove the excess - put less on. Think about two thin coats instead of one heavy coat.
(3) all epoxy self levels. It truly does, unless there is an excess which results in footballs, lump, waves, etc. Try using less epoxy and turning by hand every 30 to 45 seconds for 15 minutes then another 15 minutes of 60 second manual rotations before putting the rod on a dryer.
(4) ask why you have bubbles. Is it because of the mixing, application technique or tool, and if so then correct. The vast majority of bubbles will burst on their own if the temperature is within range and a gentle blow through a straw will take care of the rest.

Again, heat is OK, but use sparingly and not as a crutch to correct errors of application, temperature, or technique.

Thank you everyone for their thoughts. I had a feeling I would get a lot of opinions and options from this topic, and that's a good thing. It shows there really isn't a right or wrong way but more of a what works for you. Rod building techniques are just as customizable as your rod sometimes. For me it seems my biggest issue is probably the temp of my workspace. I will try running some space heaters down there and see how much that helps.

Comments deleted



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/20/2016 04:47PM by John E Powell.

Larry, I also work in a chilly basement and when I started I struggled with thick epoxy and bubbles. Your solution might be to do as I did and try various formulations of epoxy to see which is easiest for you to use in your environment. I did that and settled on Threadmaster Lite. While I warm the two parts slightly before mixing, I never need heat to make it behave nicely or to release bubbles. It goes on easily and has plenty of pot life. If fact, as I become more proficient I may try the regular build version. Simply blowing on bubbles with a straw works great. Turning by hand for the first hour makes it level nicely, especially as I learn the proper amount to apply.

John Shear
Chippewa Falls, WI

A light finish will stay wet a little longer and release bubbles easier
65 is not cold IMHO I have done finish in colder temps If your machine is a 9 RPM that is slow for a high build finish Especially if you put on more then needed
You can try after the guides ( ONLY do the decals and butt wraps with a new mix ) are covered If it looks like you have too much Stop the turner When the finish starts to drip take off the drips Turn 180 several times checking for drips Then turn the dryer on Should help a lot

Bill - willierods.com

I personally wouldn't go without my heat gun.

I'm going to share my technique even though it will probably make many people here cringe. For fulI disclosure I will say I typically build fairly large e-glass or s-glass blanks. This may be more likely to cause damage to a light rod.

With the rod turning in a mechanical turner, glob on some finish with a small metal spatula or similar. I usually aim for slightly too much finish. Line out the edges nice and square then forget the wrap and move on. Once all wraps are covered, grab the heat gun and go back to your first wrap. Heat it for just a second or two. It will pop any bubbles, level the finish, and usually cause it to sag since you already put too much on. Take your spatula, "grab" the sag off the wrap from below, and wipe it on a rag. Hit the wrap with the heat gun again for a split second and if another sag develops, grab it as well. Repeat until no sag appears when you apply the heat. This all only takes me seconds, and since the heat never hits the blank for more than a second, it doesn't seem to heat it much. It's worked very well for me. However, many of the people who just suggested not doing it have been at this way longer than me, so maybe their advice is better.

Chris,
I do essentially the same thing, except that I use an inexpensive disposable brush.

Been doing it the same way for years, with no blank or finish issues.

Be safe

Try the search feature regarding this topic , probably keep you reading till Easter.

Hello,

Regarding heat guns, if you can find one of the smaller ones meant for embossing--those have the perfect velocity for popping bubbles without blowing dust onto your wraps.

Chad

I got a nice heat gun from ace hardware store there name on it . there is two fan speeds and 5 temperature setting plus it is made were it can be placed pointing up so you have your hands free . I use it to soften epoxy to strip rods down for repair or no heat and just air to release bubbles.

I use an infrared heat lamp. No blower, so no dust blown around. I regard an alcohol lamp as a disaster that has found a place to happen.

Before mixing the finish, I turn on the lamp. By the time the epoxy is mixed and the guide wraps are all coated; about five minutes; the lamp is not quite at full heat, but hot enough. With the rod turning on the dryer motor, I place the lamp directly below each guide for a few seconds each. That's all it takes. Turn off the dryer, and hand rotate for the next hour before turning the dryer back on.

[www.youtube.com]

Check the video at time stamp - 6:00 - 6:30.

Notice, the one comment about the rod dryer is in a 100 degree environment.

Note the time stamp of 6:23, where a torch is used to burn off any thread nibs - in between costs of rod finish.

Thanks for the video. I really like the idea of the heat lamp/s. I think I am going to dry to come up with a DIYS drying box with heat lamps and see if that makes a difference. Thanks again guys.